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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1899
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, November 13, 2008 - 08:20 pm: | 
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Early St. Lawrence Engines Part II
I will print-scan and repost the St Lawrence history !
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1900
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, November 13, 2008 - 08:36 pm: |
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Blair
Don Buffetts serial # 428 is a very interesting old engine, its one of the later made of the first 500 produced by St Lawrence and although no serial number on the round tag the number 428 is stamped into both blocks, year of mfgr 1908-09 ca, it has a large letterd plate on top of the manifold ? the only other engine I know of like this one is J.B.Castagnos's, it powers his Bateau !
These engines are truly 100 Years old !
Serial # 428
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bgoss
Senior Member
Username: bgoss
Post Number: 60
Registered: 12-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, November 13, 2008 - 10:21 pm: |
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Very nice looking restoration. You'll be able to add another like that to your list in a minute Richard.
1) No S/N on small rectangle tag, single cylinder, 2 piece dry manifold, lever ignition, 1/2NPT, 2 piece coupling-eccentric, 11 3/4" flywheel with 2 1/8" face (photos at start of first posting).
2) No S/N on round tag, twin, 2 piece wet manifold, rotary ignition, 1/2NPT, separate coupling, gear pump, 15 3/4" flywheel with 2" face
  
3) #752 brass tag w/no model, single, 2 piece wet manifold, lever ignition, 1/2NPT, 2 piece coupling-eccentric, old style pump, 11 3/4" flywheel with 2" face
  
4) #1371 brass tag w/no model, single, 2 piece wet manifold, lever ignition, 1/2NPT, integral coupling-eccentric, old style pump, 11 3/4" flywheel with 1 7/8" face
 
5) #5567 brass tag w/no model, twin, 1 piece wet manifold, lever ignition, 1/2NPT, integral coupling-eccentric, old style pump, no baffle plate, 14" flywheel with 1 15/16" face
 
6) #6535 brass tag w/no model, twin, 1 piece wet manifold, lever ignition, 1/2NPT, integral coupling-eccentric, old style pump, with baffle plate, 14" flywheel with 1 7/8" face
 
7) #6997 brass tag w/no model, twin, 1 piece wet manifold, lever ignition, 18mm plugs, integral coupling-eccentric, old style pump with bell, baffle plate, 14" flywheel with just over 2" face
 
8) #7035 brass tag w/no model, twin, 1 piece wet manifold, lever ignition, 18mm plugs, integral coupling-eccentric, old style pump with bell, baffle plate, 14" flywheel with 1 1/2" face
 
9) #7724 aluminum tag with model XB, single, 1 piece wet manifold, lever ignition, 18mm plug, integral coupling-eccentric, 2 flange pump, baffle plate, 13" flywheel with 1 1/2" face
 
There are a few more in the area in collectors hands that we will try to get S/Ns off. |
richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1901
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, November 13, 2008 - 11:18 pm: |
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OK Blair - all photos filed, all entered on data list.
These Engines span 42 years of St Lawrence production ! Outstanding.
With this post we have added 11 engines to the list today, give it another day or so and i'll post updated list !!
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barry
Senior Member
Username: barry
Post Number: 83
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Friday, November 14, 2008 - 10:08 pm: |
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I visited John Laing in Port Dover Ontario.
Here are images of one of his St Lawrence engines.
More to come
Barry
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barry
Senior Member
Username: barry
Post Number: 84
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Friday, November 14, 2008 - 10:39 pm: |
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Here is another John Laing St Lawrence:
Serial 6574
Model XA - small single, 3 1/4B x 3 1/2S
Aluminum Piston
18mm plug
Thin flywheel 1 5/8 thick
Brass tag with black background
Composite water pump -- old style single flange pump body, new style eccentric, band and pump piston.
By pass baffels
Barry
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1902
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Friday, November 14, 2008 - 10:53 pm: |
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Barry
This old twin reaches back in time, a dry exhaust with water exiting cylinder heads, seems that the cylinder casting had no design for a water outlet just above the manifold ? first one we've seen like that on here ?
The numbers look to be stamped with 3 different stamp sets could it be the 07 # or 17# or 245* or What ?? I will put this as the oldest in the list for now.
My Hair has been turning white lately but things like this are helping it along. GREAT OLD ENGINE thanks for the post.
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barry
Senior Member
Username: barry
Post Number: 85
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Friday, November 14, 2008 - 10:53 pm: |
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Here is the third and last John Laing St lawrence
Serial 5632
Model XB - large single - 3 1/2B x 4S
Cast iron piston
Old style single flange water pump and eccentric
Brass tag 1 1/4 x 3 3/4
Flywheel 14" D - 1 7/8 thick
Barry
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1903
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Friday, November 14, 2008 - 11:47 pm: |
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Barry - all photos filed and all information entered on data list !
The Twin I've listed as oldest engine so far.
The 6574# single dates mid 1930's ca
The 5632# single dates late 1920's ca
This info not written in stone just sort of fitting a pattern here-- will wait to see if anymore info shows up before I repost the updated data list.
55 engines listed so far !
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1904
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, November 15, 2008 - 09:37 am: |
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This is St Lawrence Engine List Copy 2 and 2a a work still in progress but several would like to see it!
I separated the list with a space at WW I and WW II, For reference points !
Let me know of errors and new information, especially need proof of mfgr of the four digit serial numbered engines that start with 5 or 6 ?
we,ve done quite well in just a few days here, the input is appreciated very much !!
Keep those cards and letters coming in ( in new age lingo-- emails and postings )
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bgoss
Senior Member
Username: bgoss
Post Number: 61
Registered: 12-2007
| | Posted on Saturday, November 15, 2008 - 09:57 am: |
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Barry, thanks for getting those pictures of John's engines. Very interesting differences in the first one especially. |
barry
Senior Member
Username: barry
Post Number: 87
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Saturday, November 15, 2008 - 11:40 am: |
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Blair,
The nametag style and shape on John's and your twin look the same.
Did you check your flywheel for stampings similar to John's?
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barry
Senior Member
Username: barry
Post Number: 88
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Saturday, November 15, 2008 - 12:01 pm: |
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Blair,
I refered to your engine as a twin, it's a single.
I thought it would be useful to post side by side images of the two engines as they may be the oldest yet discovered.
The separate fuel/exhaust manifords are common features, the difference is cooling water exit.
That is not an original carb on John's engine, maybe his used a St Lawrence carb also.
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jb_castagnos
Senior Member
Username: jb_castagnos
Post Number: 411
Registered: 07-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, November 15, 2008 - 06:53 pm: |
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That's the same tag I have on my engine. The number on the flywheel may be a date code and the serial #. 07 the year, 17, maybe the seventeenth day, the serial #245 would be about right for the time. I've looked mine over again and didn't see a number. |
bgoss
Senior Member
Username: bgoss
Post Number: 62
Registered: 12-2007
| | Posted on Sunday, November 16, 2008 - 09:03 am: |
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JB, I got word from Don Buffett that the number on his is located on the top of both blocks on the manifold side. We scratched and scraped away at ours and can't find anything either.
I got to wondering, the early engines that would fall below S/N 500 (small rectangle and round tags), all appear to have the intake inlet straight out from the engine (no step down). Is there a chance that all of these originally came with the St.L carb? The carb has the step down in it's design. |
jb_castagnos
Senior Member
Username: jb_castagnos
Post Number: 412
Registered: 07-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, November 16, 2008 - 07:12 pm: |
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While looking for a number on my motor I noticed a plug on the lower side of the cylinders opposite side of the carb, guessing they were for a drip oiler. how many others have this, I see the ones with the baffle don't. |
richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1910
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 01:38 pm: |
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These photos just came in From Bill Nanfield (captainbill). Thanks Bill Great Old Engine.
The large lettered plate on the manifold on this engine is removable to inspect and clean inside !
How about those water pipes coming out of the heads ?
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barry
Senior Member
Username: barry
Post Number: 91
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 01:58 pm: |
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Looks like a mate for John Laing's Twin,
Any numbers stamped into the flywheel? reference my post #88 Nov 15.
Barry |
richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1912
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 02:22 pm: |
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Bill said he was getting out the magnifying glass !
That is a St Lawrence launch that the engine is sitting in !
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barry
Senior Member
Username: barry
Post Number: 92
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 04:14 pm: |
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Bill,
Would you post some images of your St Lawrence launch?
Attached info suggests yours is a 20' model because of the two cylinder engine.
Mr Clyde Drew's testimonial dated 1910 indicates he owned the launch for 3 years so it was built 1907.
Barry
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jb_castagnos
Senior Member
Username: jb_castagnos
Post Number: 414
Registered: 07-2002
| | Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 06:59 pm: |
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I've never had the plate off my manifold, but if it's open under it, it would be the equivilant of a modern core plug. They used this opening to support the core and covered it with the plate. |
bgoss
Senior Member
Username: bgoss
Post Number: 63
Registered: 12-2007
| | Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 07:54 pm: |
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Can we take a closer look at that water pump?
Looks like the same mounting arrangement, but otherwise different water inlet location than any of the others.
While you have the tag off, make sure that you check for a number under where the tag would be mounted. I didn't want to take off our tag for fear of breaking off those tiny screws. |
richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1913
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 09:04 pm: |
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Waterpump Early Twin above post.
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Don C
Visitor
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 19, 2008 - 08:28 am: |
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I have St Lawrence #7737, XA model recovered (many years ago) from an abandoned Dispro on the N shore of Lk Superior
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1916
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 19, 2008 - 02:49 pm: |
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Don
Serial # added to our St Lawrence Engines list.
#7737 Falls inbetween engs mfgd in 1947 !
Thanks for posting serial # and Photo.
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