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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1390
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 03:47 pm: | 
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27 # Whats The name ?
More than 60 Marine engine mfgrs were in the state of Connecticut before 1930 ! Whats The Name of this one ??
1913-14
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ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie
Post Number: 537
Registered: 01-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 03:59 pm: |
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Not a moor |
richardday
Senior Member
Username: richardday
Post Number: 451
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 05:03 pm: |
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Looks like a Palmer to me. |
richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1395
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 22, 2007 - 11:43 am: |
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27 # Whats The Name
1913-14
This ad says two port engs ? Did Palmer mfgr two port engs this late ??
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ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie
Post Number: 539
Registered: 01-2002
| | Posted on Monday, January 22, 2007 - 01:01 pm: |
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Well the one in the pic is certainly a 3 port. The add says 3 types of engines I wonder if they were refering to the B, C, D and E series engines as the 2 port ones. That style of engines were made into the 30's or even later.
There were 2 port Q series engines but I don't think they were this late. Mr Day? |
richardday
Senior Member
Username: richardday
Post Number: 452
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 23, 2007 - 06:50 am: |
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I have listed several dozen Palmer model Q-1 made as late as 1925 At least 12 Q-2 including one made in 1923. 2 ea Q-3. Both made in 1913. I have a Q-2 with an intake manifold that is horizontal rather than V shaped. I do know that Palmer had tried many different intake manifolds over the years so I dont let that get in the way of assuming which model the basic engine is. The Q came out in 1905 as a two port according to the catalogs. It changed in 1906 to a three port. We also know from existing engines they made a swing arm timer early on before going to a mitre gear driven Palmer timer half way up the cylinder. My 1916 Q-1 has a Cuno timer and it looks to be the orignal timer as the Palmer timer was very much different from the Cuno. Have not decided what the 4 stroke model is at the moment Suspect it is an F or K. Will have to dig out the catalogs of that period. Best I can offer at the moment. |
richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1398
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 23, 2007 - 09:16 pm: |
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1914
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richardday
Senior Member
Username: richardday
Post Number: 453
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 09:05 am: |
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Thanks Richard. Note the water pump has the external check valves. I think the built in check valves first appeared in about 1919. That is based on the photos in catalogs I have but I know Palmer often used photos from years other than the catalog year which doesn't help sort this detail out. The only known surviving F parts are for a model F-2 are the flywheel and crankshaft that came off the Oxford/Bellvue MD. Ferry ramp counter weight. I alerted Max Homfeld to its location and he contacted the ferry owners and they helped him retrieve it for the Chesapeake Bay Maritime Museum in St. Michaels, MD. He also retrieved two new old stock F cylinders from a Palmer family (not related to the Palmer Bros. family) up in Connecticut. It seems this Palmer family were in the fishing business and had a Palmer Model F in one of their boats. In about 1938 Frank Palmer alerted some of the old customers that he was getting rid of all the new old stock F and Model K engine parts. If they would come to the Cos Cob factory they could have any they wanted. Apparently this family took Frank up on his offer, Years later I forget now exactly when the family contacted the CBM staff and offered the old parts to the museum if they would come pick them up. Max immeadiately went up to CT. and brought back a number of items of which two were the model F cylinders. He was planning to make a mock up useing the flywheel and cylinders to give people an idea of just how big these engines were. Unfortunately Max died before he got to that project and I guess that is where it ended. |
richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1400
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 11:10 am: |
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Dick the F and big brother K engines seem unique from other Palmer engs with the 4 bolt plates for water and intake manifold connections at the cylinders.
This is 1913 Catalog specs and a look at the intake manifold side, The F intake manifold is a piece of mechanical art to my eye .
1913 Model F
1913 Heavy Duty model K engines- 7 1/2 Bore 10 stoke !
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1401
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 11:27 am: |
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This is the pic that should have been in the above post.
The delete option is not working and I can't delete a posting mistake ??
Palmer 1913 heavy duty model K engines
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richardday
Senior Member
Username: richardday
Post Number: 454
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 08:38 pm: |
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Richard, I posted a picture in the factory showing a pile of F or K cylinders. Their valve cages bolted on to the sides of the cylinders. I don't know why they were not cast in place unless they just got too complicated/big for the foundry to get a reasonable yield. We know the poor yeild in the foundry was why most makers long before Palmer gave up the dome head over the detachable head. Once Henry Ford solved the head gasket problem the dome head was on its way out the door for a lot of engine makers. |
richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee
Post Number: 1406
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 09:19 pm: |
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Cool old photo
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