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| Should we include engines later than ... |
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andrew
| | Posted on Thursday, November 01, 2001 - 11:53 am: | 
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The question came up before that 1940 was too early a cutoff for the range of engines covered on this site. This is probably an appropiate time to discuss it. Please post your feedback here in this thead... add a message below.
Some options include:
1) Pre WWII engines.
2) Pre 1950 engines.
3) Pre 1960 engines.
I would appreciate your thoughts. As I have mentioned before I think it is appropiate to limit our focus to some range of dates rather that try to cover any marine engine.
Regards,
Andrew
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rob
| | Posted on Thursday, November 01, 2001 - 08:46 pm: |
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Well, down here in Aussie land, single/twin cylinder engines of the sort we normally associate with being "antique" were manufactured well into the '60's.... Infact, the Simplex 4 strokes singles & twins continue to be made..... So I'd go for pre 1960 at least..... Just my opinion..... :-) |
Len Tate
| | Posted on Friday, November 02, 2001 - 04:10 am: |
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I agree with Rob. In Australia most boats are used in salt water, as, being the driest continent, we don't have many lakes and rivers that are suitable for boating. The result of this is that it's very unusual to find a really old engine (say earlier than 1950) as rust will have ruined it long ago. I have a number of marine engine cylinders that have cracked as a result of salt and rust build up. The old engine designs were however, kept in production well into the 60's and one or two are still manufactured, so pre 1960 is a good period. |
J.B. Castagnos
| | Posted on Friday, November 02, 2001 - 06:00 am: |
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I'm more interested in the type of engine than the year produced, if we understand this we can discuss engines that fit the bill. The date was used to keep the discussion limited to the engines we like, if these engines were made later I have no objections to them. J.B. Castagnos |
Ernie
| | Posted on Friday, November 02, 2001 - 07:19 am: |
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Most of the Stuart engines we have been talking about were built in the 50's or later. My R3 was built in 1958. I agree with JB it's more the type not the year. I for one don't want to get into multi port fuel injection on a big block chevy. I get enough of that at work. Maybe what we are talking about is the "Lo Tech" fun stuff. |
Bill Schaller
| | Posted on Friday, November 02, 2001 - 05:02 pm: |
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Red Wing built many of the same models in 1960, just before going out of business, as they built in the late 30's. If the serial tag is off them, you almost can not date them. I think this is true of many of the non automobile based engines, there was not much progress made from the late 30's to the fifties. I think 1950 would be a better cutoff. Once into the fifties, the outboards get bigger, and put most of the older types out of business. |
Robert Holcomb
| | Posted on Friday, November 02, 2001 - 07:32 pm: |
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The latest engines i am working on are both late 30`s a vivian and an easthope.I have a palmer pw-27 that i understand was built in the 60`s but fits in with the looks of the older engines |
Joe Holmes
| | Posted on Saturday, November 03, 2001 - 03:33 pm: |
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I agree with all who have responded. There are the really really old and the not so old engines. The people who use this forum will tend to know the interest. I think though that a limit would be useful and my feeling tends to say 1960. The reason for the late year is as said by Rob at the top....some old engines were still being made in 1960. Take the Easthopes that Robert Holcomb mentioned, they started in 1900 and ended in the 1960's and didn't change all that much.If someone wanted info on a 1965 V-8 for example, I'm sure he would find encouragement to phone the dealer, something you cannot do with the older stuff and so enters Andrew and OldMarineEngine.com..... thank you Sir...... |
Ernie
| | Posted on Sunday, November 04, 2001 - 05:27 pm: |
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I think the year is a rough guide line. We all seem to police ourselves quite well. If someone ends up here looking for info on something that is not approiate he/she will probably get a polite redirect to where the info will be available. Remember, if you have enough money and are good at pleading a cause you might get a brand new 2001 Atlantic from Nova Scotia. I for one want to know if you do! |
andrew
| | Posted on Sunday, November 04, 2001 - 06:37 pm: |
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Great feedback... thanks!
I think it is clear that the early style engine is the primary focus of this site regardless of when they were built.... therefore including Stuart, Acadia, Atlantic, Easthope, etc.
The gray area generally concerns the multi-cylinder higher RPM engines. I think we would all agree that a four cylinder Kermath or Graymarine from the 1930's or 1940's would be included... but a six cylinder Chrysler from the 1960's or 1970's probably shouldn't be.
We don't neccessarily have to define our mission right now, but it is helpful for us to have some kind of guidelines when we politely suggest that the person with the Mercruiser Inboard/Outboard try somewhere else to find out what the firing order is.
It also occurs to me that the core group of users of this site are primarily interested in the early style, low RPM engines... and we could limit the site to that... but there were a lot of very interesting early, higher RPM, multi-cylinder inboards and we might broaden the appeal of the site by including them (or maybe we shouldn't...).
Just thinking outloud here and would appreciate other ideas...
Maybe a definition that included description and age such as:
Quote:Early style one lung marine inboards of the style commonly manufactured prior to to 1940 and multi-cylinder four cycle inboards prior to 1960 (or 1950).
Thanks.
Andrew |
Ernie
| | Posted on Monday, November 05, 2001 - 08:07 pm: |
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Andrew,
To put it in your words, just thinking outloud, do we need a defination? To some of us old farts 1960 isn't old. However a lot of our members, or readers can't remember 1960. I seem to remember a thread about a problem with a charging system on an early inboard with a 302 Ford. (Early?? the 302 came out in 1968) I did some digging and found the info on some web page devoted to early Ford Falcons. So where is the line between the port FI big block engines and the carburerated small blocks?????????
Maybe lets leave the guidelines as they were/are. If someone posts a message and we can help so much the better.
Part of the old engine hobby is good honest folks that honestly want to help in any way they can. Yup if I can help on the big block V8 I'll try. However it will definatly (as best I can) be over on marineengine.com or oldboat.com.
I just picked up a neat 1 hp Regal by helping with a V8 M345 225hp at 4000 RPM Palmer. So big and fast still leads to old and slow.
Remember all this was thinking outloud. So my thinking is:
Old Marine Engine dot Com
If your defination of old isn't old by our standards we will point you as best we can to where the info you need is. Our main intrest is 60's vintage or earlier "low pressure" inboards.(quote from the late Weston Farmer)
Geesh that was 100 words or more in a 10 word bag.
Early style one lung marine inboards of the style commonly manufactured prior to to 1940 and multi-cylinder four cycle inboards of 60's vintage or earlier. |
Richard Day
| | Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2001 - 10:04 pm: |
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I think most of us are interested in antique marine engines and the year isn't all that important. Atlantics were made up until a couple of years ago and yet I consider them antiques in every sense of the word except their age. If someone comes up with an Atlantic made in 1992 and has a problem or what ever they should not feel that the 1992 manufactureing date is grounds for not asking for help or making a comment. At the CMM show if someone shows up with a 1992 Atlantic they will be welcome despite the show brochure that says 1975. |
Brendon Young
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 20, 2001 - 12:47 pm: |
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After placing a few heat transfer queries across in the hope of striking someone that could help me in my ongoing struggle to marinise a rather "Modern ford",I was disapointed to see talk of setting a year requirement on engine age.
My point is that,most naturally asperated engines(pre-computer age),share alot of the same,basic fundamentals: Suck,spark,bang,blow!
Apart from workshop manuals,there seems to be limited info on anything older than 20 years old. I feel sure that any appropriate marinising questions,regardless of the actual age of a motor, should be considered as there is obviously a wealth of infomation to be shared & gathered here from people who have a genuine interest in restoring and maintaining older marine engines.
My suggestion to you guys is to keep an open mind when it comes to engine discussion,and as long as the questions or ideas are of a genuine nature and within some-sort of realistic boundary regarding the older marine engine/concept,give it a go. |
scott morris
| | Posted on Friday, November 30, 2001 - 12:34 pm: |
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I have a 1957 Palmer and despite it being a modern powerplant have always received a helpful response to my questions from OME. I've never been ignored because of the cutoff. I think the spirit of the hobby prevails and don't see the need to adjust the format when the members of OME find a way to lend a helpful hand. |
Richard Day
| | Posted on Saturday, December 01, 2001 - 05:35 pm: |
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The ZR-4 the Scott Morris has is the last ZR-4 made by Palmer in 1957. I talked to several of the old hands at Palmer and they all remembered the engine as they hadn't assembled one since pre WWII. They had a lot of trouble trying to figure out how they put it together to meet the factory clearances etc. Fortunately its never been in salt water and it is in mint conditionl. |
chuck balyeat
| | Posted on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 11:39 pm: |
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I think the OME.Com logo says it all .
No craftsman OB's or chevy mercs in here |
volksyfolks
New member
Username: volksyfolks
Post Number: 1
Registered: 10-2008
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 29, 2008 - 02:30 am: |
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can anyone tell me where I can get more info on this motor?
it's in yhitehorse yukon, more pics comming
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miro
Senior Member
Username: miro
Post Number: 349
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, November 02, 2008 - 09:03 pm: |
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Really interesting discussion .
From my viewpoint, I start with the question - What were these engines for?
They weren't designed for boats that planed - they were designed for displacement hulls.
I think of our pals in Oz - with 1950's engines in really nice wooden hulled boats.
Old marine engine says it all.
Recently in the Muskoka and surrounding Regions, there has been a movement ( pardon the pun) towards "Go Slow Boating"
It's a reaction to the ever increasing size horsepower and weight of smaller pleasure boats.
And the interesting thing is that it is drawing a greater and greater audience.
Who knows, could it be someday, that a modern low compression low horsepower engine is produced that fills the need.
I've seen an electric start one cylinder diesel engine in a DisPro hull. A bit unofficial but will run all summer on a quart of fuel.
Age is part of the description of an antique, but form and function come into the discussion too.
miro |
eddie
Senior Member
Username: eddie
Post Number: 224
Registered: 04-2003
| | Posted on Monday, November 03, 2008 - 01:54 pm: |
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For years Palmer P-60 owners have relied upon this site for information about their engines because they had virtually nowhere else to go. Perhaps the designation should be revised to "antique and classic marine engines" |
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