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agsem
New member
Username: agsem
Post Number: 1
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Sunday, September 30, 2007 - 08:31 pm: | 
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http://www.agsem.com/newdonations.html
September 29, 2007 we were donated this gasoline Gray Marine engine. I am hoping someone will be able to identify the year this 6-91 engine was built and who built the base engine? As well as any records as to its history.
Since I could clearly read the engine number in my viewfinder I did not write it down. But now, picture # 14, I cannot make out what the first digit is after the B, and, of course, I cannot remember. The other three, 263, are clearly visible.
Thank you,
Greg Hayden
webmaster |
larry_from_maryland
Senior Member
Username: larry_from_maryland
Post Number: 265
Registered: 07-2003
| | Posted on Monday, October 01, 2007 - 07:18 pm: |
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Post all the casting numbers you can. I have some ideas ,but this engine is older than the ones i am used to working on. |
larry_from_maryland
Senior Member
Username: larry_from_maryland
Post Number: 267
Registered: 07-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 03, 2007 - 12:23 pm: |
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Anyone have the bore and stroke for the 6-91. |
bruce
Senior Member
Username: bruce
Post Number: 155
Registered: 07-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 03, 2007 - 09:30 pm: |
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My notes say "B" series Gray engines were 1940 era. Serial Numbers started with #1000. Could this be S/N B 1263? |
agsem
New member
Username: agsem
Post Number: 2
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 03, 2007 - 10:48 pm: |
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Could be. That space between the B and 2 is like brass weld spatter there. A series of tiny little bumpy something on the tag. I may carefully take a tiny file and see if I can rub it off without hurting what is underneath. The way the B and 263 were struck hard and easily visible I did not easily see a number beneath this stuff, but perhaps that is because it is the number one.
Thanx we appreciate all the help we can get.
Question. Was/is it common practice to number marine gas engine cylinders from the prop end of the engine as this one is? I think of the prop end as the aft end of the engine.
Greg Hayden
http://www.agsem.com/newdonations.html
Bruce said:
My notes say "B" series Gray engines were 1940 era. Serial Numbers started with #1000. Could this be S/N B 1263? |
larry_from_maryland
Senior Member
Username: larry_from_maryland
Post Number: 268
Registered: 07-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, October 04, 2007 - 12:33 pm: |
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My first impression looking at it is that its a waukeshaw, but would like the bore and stroke to check in my books. Chrysler engines used the rear cylinder as number 1. This was allso true in their tractor engines. Lots of people i meet at shows swear that all the old flat head engines use the rear cylinder as number 1. However the service manuels say the oppisite. |
bruce
Senior Member
Username: bruce
Post Number: 156
Registered: 07-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, October 04, 2007 - 09:56 pm: |
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larry- page 104 in Volume 1 of Engines Afloat by Stan Grayson says Gray first converted Erd motors and then Studebaker light six's. The 1927 6-90 was based on the Studebaker. They also used Pontiac 6cyl engines in 1927.(maybe this was the 6-91 to differentiate it from the Studebaker based 6-90??) Richarson Boat company used the Pontiac based Graymarine engines according to Graysons article. Hercules blocks were also used in 1927.I'm thinking this engine is an early 30's/late 20's model???Would that be the distributor drive protruding from the head? |
agsem
New member
Username: agsem
Post Number: 3
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Friday, October 05, 2007 - 01:23 am: |
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I wondered about that too, having read what you have written Bruce on several Gray Marine oriented web sites. One site mentions Studebaker and Pontiac but also Packard. I recall the mention of the distributor through the head. But atop our head on the port side of the engine is what appears to be a tachometer drive. The distributor is on a boss on the starboard side of the block.
Also, while it may not be evident from my pictures, the water pump is driven off the back of the generator.
Thanx Bruce,
Greg Hayden |
agsem
Member
Username: agsem
Post Number: 4
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Friday, October 05, 2007 - 11:56 pm: |
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Update with twelve new October 05, 2007 pictures:
http://www.agsem.com/newdonations.html
I enlisted the 14 year old eyes of Eric McConnon to help me. Above far left picture: Engine number B0263. Either that is an oh or a zero between the B and the 2. There was an epoxy like substance covering this number that easily scraped off with a putty knife. Above left: My pictures did not show it and my memory falsely told me the distributor was on an engine boss. It is not. The distributor is an Auto-Lite. It is displayed like this with a hyphen between the two words. # 1GW4113 space 12 space T. The distributor is driven off the back of the gear driven Auto-Lite generator # GAL space 4336 Toledo Ohio USA. You will note in the above left and above right pictures behind the Delco-Remy coil the words Gray Marine cast into the starboard side of the block. Picture above far right: we took the coil off to make it clearer. Besides driving the distributor from the back of the generator the shaft continues to also drive the M.L.Oberorfer Brass, Syracuse NY, water pump. Also the freeze plugs visible in above pictures have HUBBARD imprinted around the perimeter and a logo like a C on the inside of a V. Below far left and left: lifting eye on the prop end of the engine, # 118 clearly visible. Before that may be an H, an 8, a B, or something else entirely. Below right: FIRING ORDER cast into the head. Below far right: firing order 153624 mostly hidden by a bracket.
Below far left: in the center of the head is this area that looks like an oval indented space was cast into the head then this oval metal piece with K screw head 7 screw head X held in place by the two flat head machine screws. Below left: what I think is a tachometer drive? At the top of the picture another view of the K 7 X oval plate. Below right: on the aft port side of the head CL (like CenterLine on plans) M. We believe the 1 designates number one cylinder. Below far right: aft port side of block: CL again (like CenterLine on plans) space K space 18 space X. Below that A600A414
To the left, where the yellow shows, the four rivets made us think we had found some kind of plate, but there is not. The numbers 4224 were struck, versus cast, into the block in this space. In several places what we took to be cast in place numbers actually was heavy scale that scraped off with a putty knife.
Greg Hayden |
