Vivian Marine Diesels

Author Message   Andy Hathaway Posted on Thursday, April 15, 2004 - 03:45 pm:        I have two six cylinder diesels 6 3/4" bore X 10" stroke working in my boat. Attached are two gears, 1:1 w/ reverse. They are not functioning correctly as they do not stay in reverse or never get fully engaged. Engines work well. Trans do not. They are known as Joe's Gears. I am looking for someone with some expertise in the gears as well as tuning up the engines. Any info would be gratefully accepted.   robert New member Username: robert Post Number: 1 Registered: 07-2004 Posted on Friday, July 16, 2004 - 12:03 pm:        I have a factory manual for the engine. Do you need a copy? Dan Grinstead in Seattle knows Vivians and Joe's Gears I'm sure. There is certainly expertise around Vancouver/Victoria B.C. too, as Vivians were common around here and were in a few B.C. Ferry Corp. vessels into the 1970s and perhaps 80s. Deas Dock in Ladner would be a good place to ask around.   robert New member Username: robert Post Number: 2 Registered: 07-2004 Posted on Friday, July 16, 2004 - 12:36 pm:        I assume this is the same engine?   Michael Kenneth Taylor Visitor Posted on Sunday, March 12, 2006 - 02:34 pm:        I have a metal plate: 4" X 12 3/4" with 8 mounting holes, and raised lettering: 9 X 12, Vivian-Diesel, Vivian Diesels and Munitions Ltd., No. of Cyls. 6, Vancouver B.C. Canada, Engine No. 2650. I would like to identify the vessel or ?, and the date. All advice is most welcome. Thanks   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 103 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Monday, March 13, 2006 - 06:29 pm:        According to the Articles of Incorporation, Vivian Diesels & Munitions Ltd. was incorporated August 18th, 1942. Therefore your engine was probably made after that date. Unfortunately, Canadian Car and Foundry who ended up with all the Vivian Engine Works records, patterns, parts etc. destroyed the lot in about 1976. I've heard a story that some material was saved, but unless the sales ledgers survived somehow and one day surface, I doubt you will ever find out what vessel the engine was on, except by tracing the previous owners and asking them.   redneckalbertan New member Username: redneckalbertan Post Number: 1 Registered: 06-2006 Posted on Thursday, June 29, 2006 - 01:47 am:        My Uncle recently came upon an 8 cylinder Vivian Engine. It runs but he is looking for information on firing order of the engine as well as other general information on the engine. I was wondering where a person could start looking for this.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 112 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Thursday, June 29, 2006 - 10:02 am:        What size engine is it? Is there a maker's plate still? I have some manuals I could copy for you if you find out which model it is. Is this gas or diesel?   eric_schulz New member Username: eric_schulz Post Number: 1 Registered: 01-2007 Posted on Friday, January 05, 2007 - 10:57 pm:        Readers may be interested to know that Vivian engines were also built under licence in Australia by Commercial Steels & Forge Co P/L, Sydney. This was in 1945. Only the 4 cyl, 6-3/4 x 10, 80hp size was built. How many were built or for how long I do not know.}}   sailmaster New member Username: sailmaster Post Number: 3 Registered: 11-2006 Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 07:34 am:        When I was in the Canadian Navy I was lucky enough to work on a large Vivian diesel. It was a generator on the HMCS Cape Britain. The ship saw action in Normandy and was a floating foundry and machine shop. I and another L/S Engineer were tasked in getting it running back in 1980. It was at least 200 KW or larger and was started with compressed air. You may info at the Canadian Armed Forces Fleet School in Esquimalt, Victoria B.C. They keep allot of old manuals around. The Cape Britain is now a artificial reef near Nanaimo, B.C.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 151 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 10:08 am:        I assume that was the Cape Breton?   sailmaster Member Username: sailmaster Post Number: 4 Registered: 11-2006 Posted on Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 08:21 am:        Your right. It was spelled Cape Breton, but I wrote the e-mail in word and pasted it and I guess it spell checked it to Britain. Do you know the ship? Are you Canadain? I figured if you new the spelling for Cape Breton Island then you probably are. I am but live in Grenada on my sailbot currently.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 152 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 04:09 pm:        I knew of the ship. I am Canadian. Wish I was in Grenada in a sailboat! Eric, that is interesting info. Are any engines still running there, or any stocks of spares still in existence somewhere?   eric_schulz Member Username: eric_schulz Post Number: 6 Registered: 01-2007 Posted on Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 08:33 pm:        *Are any engines still running there, or any stocks of spares still in existence somewhere?* That's more than I can say, but the chances are pretty slim on either question as this is over 60 years ago. My interest is not in shipping, just engines, Especially researching Australian engine history.}}   nzvivian New member Username: nzvivian Post Number: 1 Registered: 06-2007 Posted on Tuesday, June 05, 2007 - 07:01 pm:        Good morning, I have some questions regarding a 3 cylinder Vivian inboard diesel. I don't know very much about it, other than it is the 52hp model. I would very much like to get a workshop manual or other information on the unit. Any help would be really appreciated. Please email me with any questions, information or otherwise. Or post it here, for the edification of all. Cheers, Dave   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 166 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Tuesday, June 05, 2007 - 10:56 pm:        Hello Dave, NZ is New Zealand I assume? Do you know what the bore and stroke of the engine are? So far, your's is the first three cylinder is existence I have heard of. I know 2, 3 and 4 cylinder engines were made, but have not heard of a 2 or 3 cylinder surviving till now. I can probably help with a manual if we know the size. Is there a maker's plate on the engine and is it running or not?   nzvivian New member Username: nzvivian Post Number: 2 Registered: 06-2007 Posted on Tuesday, June 05, 2007 - 11:37 pm:        Yes, Christchurch New Zealand. Thank you for your prompt response. I am writting on behalf of one of the men I work with, so I will pass on these questions. We will reply when we get more details. The engine is not running, but was powering the irrigator on his farm until the 1970s - until a flood took out the pump house. Assuming, incorrectly it turns out, that the engine had taken water on and 'hydraulic'd', the insurance company paid for an electric motor replacement. With a new manifold made (after the original corroded) and installed, the unit has since sat in the workshop.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 167 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 01:49 am:        OK, will await your further info. If the manifold corroded and split, we can assume this was a marine engine, not a stationary I think. Hope the owner has it full of straight anti-freeze, in the water jackets that is?   nzvivian New member Username: nzvivian Post Number: 3 Registered: 06-2007 Posted on Tuesday, June 12, 2007 - 05:16 pm:        Let us begin... The injector pump has a plate on it stating: American Bosch APE 3B-100P-400 5603 27499 The side plate on the govenor drive: 550-243 Govenor no: A1 795115 Tappet Cover no (perhaps a part number?): 5-1104 and the bore is 5 1/2". We have a set of rings for it! Any help would really be appreciated. Thanks   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 168 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Tuesday, June 12, 2007 - 10:54 pm:        That's the first time I've heard of a bore less than 6" in a Vivian. The injection side of it is all off-the-shelf Bosch kit IIRC, so you should have no trouble getting parts there. There should be a plate measuring about 3" x 4" similar to this one on the engine.   fred gagen Visitor Posted on Sunday, June 24, 2007 - 04:02 am:        Looking for info on likely engine as fitted to 50ft.Admiralty Motor Fishing Vessel...Year 1950. It was hand-cranked but no other details. Info needed for research. Thanks in anticipation.   Gordon Dunlop Visitor Posted on Wednesday, August 01, 2007 - 12:13 pm:        Hi, I have available a 160 hp vivian engine that has been in storage for a few years. It was running when it was taken out of service as a eletric power generator for a small community that was hooked up to a larger grid. Is there any interest in this specimen? If so please e-mail me: [email protected]   David Bartle Visitor Posted on Sunday, September 09, 2007 - 03:57 am:        I worked on the Vesuvius Queen (originally the Lloyd-Jones) and the Saltspring Queen, both of which had 8 cylinder Vivian diesel (9 x 12) main engines and (6 x 9) two cylinder auxiliary diesels, Made in Vancouver BC. Both types were air start. I might have a photocopy of one of the manuals in my notes. Lloyd-Jones ran from the westside of the Okanagan lake to Kelowna BC prior to the floating bridge. It was cut up and moved to the gulf islands (BC) and re-assembled , renamed and put into service running between Crofton and Vesuvius for BCFerries. The Saltspring queen was previously named the Bowen Queen and ran originally across the Fraser river between Delta and Richmond prior to the George Massy tunnel. It was renamed the Saltspring Queen and did service between Fulford Harbour on Salt Spring Island and Swartz Bay on Vancouver Island. I think I also have some photos of the engines too. I'll check and post if I can find them.   Capt. M. Schmidt-Bremer Visitor Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 12:01 pm:        In Maputo, Mocambique, I found the tug XEFINA resting in the small craft harbour. During the years I served in the port I collected with a few other parts the makers plate (brass) of the main engine "9x12, VIVAN-DIESEL, VIVIAN DIESELS AND MUNITIONS LTD., No. Cyls. 6, VancouverB.C Canada, Engine No. 2772". The plate served as cover of the cooling system. My interest lies in the construction year and the first service area of this small tug. The wreck sank in 2000 alongside the quay.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 184 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 04:52 pm:        Interesting to hear of an engine as far off as Mozambique. We cannot be certain of the year of manufacture as all records were reportedly destroyed by Canadian Car & Foundry in about 1976. (They were the successor company) Based on serial numbers I have been able to date accurately, 2772 was likely built between 1939 and 1942. Do you have any photos of the tug, or know of its previous names, if any? Thank you for posting.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 185 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 04:57 pm:        Dave (NZVivian), sorry if you were waiting for a reply. I'm not even sure if workshop manuals were printed for these engines, or if the factory anticipated doing overhauls themselves. I can probably help with a copy of an operating manual for a larger engine. Most materials would the same or similar I suppose.   L Taub Visitor Posted on Saturday, November 24, 2007 - 05:28 pm:        I have 2 vivian engines with dc generators that has been unused for a few years. They are running and our mechanic that passed away last march was an expert in Vivian engines the 3 cylinders is a 25 KW DC output in perfect running condition and the 4 cylinder is 40 KW DC also in perfect runing condition. We overhauled both of them and also we have a 9 by 12 8 cylinder 450 HP marine engine that is installed in my ship.I changed my mind and decided to take out the generators off my boat and install 220/380 volts AC electricity onboard, so we are just know dismantelling and taking out the 2 generators off the ship. We went thru the three engines in 2003 and our project was to refurbish the ship to original condition that is why we overhauled the three engines and never used the generators since overhauled, and most important is that they are in absolutly original messurement condition like if never used. Is there any interest in this two marine generators I am willing to sell them ? I am in Tigre Argentina my email: [email protected] If so please e-mail me: [email protected]   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 186 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, November 24, 2007 - 11:07 pm:        Would you mind telling us more about your ship and where she was built? How have you found the 9x12 engine to operate? How many hours does it have and what did you late mechanic think of the engines? It is doubtful there is much market for the engines unless a buyer has such an engine and wants spares or wants a large slow running diesel for economy reasons. How is the fuel consumption on the 9x12 engines. Thanks for posting about this, always interesting to hear about surviving engines.   Tony P Visitor Posted on Sunday, January 20, 2008 - 06:40 am:        Does anyone know about any Vivian advertisments around the start of WW II ? I have a picture of my grandad's fish boat in burrard Inlet with the Vancover sun tower in the background. The Vivian engine in the boat had been rebuilt and the boat is traveling ar full speed. I was told that it was a publicity photo for Vivian engines.   GeoffScott Visitor Posted on Sunday, January 20, 2008 - 03:48 pm:        Dave Bartle: I worked on the Old Ladner Ferry in 1950. It ran between Richmond and Ladner and was replaced by the Tunnel in 1959. This ferry was called M.V Delta Princess and had two Vivian 9X12 240 BHP main engines and two Vivian 6 1/2 X 8 Two Cylinder Aux DC Generators. which were 30 BHP Original engineers were Gunner Axelson ( chief ) George Franson, Bob Cook and Myself Geoff Scott They were taken over and re-named by the BC Ferry Corp of which I retired from in 1990 off the Queen of Vancouver. Not sure if these vessels are still used ? Would be nice to find out more information or hear from you or anyone. [email protected]   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 200 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Monday, January 21, 2008 - 02:38 am:        Tony, if you can send your email to Andrew, the site owner and moderator, he can pass it on to me and I may be able to help.   James Clark Visitor Posted on Monday, February 25, 2008 - 06:52 pm:        Re. Mosambique Tug Wreck, Capt M. Scmidt-Bremer I found this posting while researching something else. In 1942, General Bridge Company of Trenton, Ontario, Canada started building 64ft., 74 ton harbour tugs for a British Admiralty order equiped with 240hp. Vivian Diesels. By 1945, 240 tugs had been built. A high degree of Prefabrication was used with even the engine room piping and wireing harneses pre assembled on jigs. Since the yard was two miles from Trenton Harbour the completed tugs were taken by rail to Trenton Harbour for launch, then accross lake Ontario and through the Erie Canal to New York for distribution as deck cargo overseas. The man in charge of this project was Herb Ditchburn. Ditchburn boats were made in the Muskoka Lakes and are now concidered prize collector's items. This Tug project is now just a footnote in History and is largely forgotten, Since they were shipped worldwide it would not surprise me if "XEFINA" is one of them.   john a brinkman Visitor Posted on Thursday, October 16, 2008 - 08:01 pm:        hi have 2 vivian gen engines 8cyl,from bethlehem iron marmora 10cyl,from eatons annex toronto looking for manuals or any lit. thanks john a brinkman   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 226 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Thursday, October 16, 2008 - 08:23 pm:        Welcome. What sizes are your engines, ie: bore and stroke? I have some manuals.   Clark Leighs Visitor Posted on Sunday, November 02, 2008 - 02:57 pm:        HI, not a member but read periodically. This is just to let you know that Burrard Yacht Club, North Vancouver, B/.C. has a tanker as part of their breakwater called the Dundurn. It has two 8 cyl Vivian diesels. The ship is still in pretty decent shape. If anyone is interested BYC maintains a website and could be contacted that way. I don't know if any one has any info about the ship and her power, But Jamie, the Mtce. Mgr would know.   Doug Berry Visitor Posted on Wednesday, November 12, 2008 - 04:57 pm:        Vancouver Vocational Institure had a running Vivian in the classroom when it was down on Pender St. They had service manuals as well. I know they moved the Campus but worth checking into.   Megan Harvey Visitor Posted on Sunday, November 16, 2008 - 03:59 pm:        Hi, Could any of you provide information about this engine? It is currently at the Museum of Transport and Technology in Auckland (NZ), but has been in storage for a few years. All I know is that it is a Vivian, 3-cylinder marine engine, type A.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 228 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, November 16, 2008 - 05:30 pm:        That is an 18hp "Medium Duty" engine. I can send you a catalogue page showing the engine, if you wish. There should be a maker's plate on the cylinder head at the flywheel end of the engine, with the serial number and HP rating. If that is missing, the serial number is also stamped on the machined flat close to the distributor/timer on the upper crankcase. With the enclosed reverse gear, this would be a late 30s or probably 1940s engine with a serial in the 3000 to 3500 range. Production of their gas engines ceased in about 1950. There would have been a WICO magneto on the mounting flange shown in the bottom right area of your first photo.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 229 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, November 16, 2008 - 05:40 pm:        That is an 18hp "Medium Duty" engine. I can send you a catalogue page showing the engine, if you wish. There should be a maker's plate on the cylinder head at the flywheel end of the engine, with the serial number and HP rating. If that is missing, the serial number is also stamped on the machined flat close to the distributor/timer on the upper crankcase. With the enclosed reverse gear, this would be a late 30s or probably 1940s engine with a serial in the 3000 to 3500 range. Production of their gas engines ceased in about 1950. There would have been a WICO magneto on the mounting flange shown in the bottom right area of your first photo.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 236 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Monday, December 08, 2008 - 01:57 am:        I have found my Vivian diesel manuals. Those interested in digital copies, please post what type of engine you need manuals for and I will try to get them digitized and posted somewhere.   David Bartle Visitor Posted on Friday, January 30, 2009 - 11:00 pm:        I have a scanned copy of the Vivian parts catalogue(no photos in manual) for a Vivian 5 1/2 x 8" engine for anyone who requires one. It seems to be for engines from 2 through 8 cylinders of this bore. Vivian Engine Works Ltd. was bought out by Can-Car or Canadian Car (Pacific) Limited, Vancouver, B.C. The parts catalogue (No.231S23) is for engines #3597 and #3598 effective March 1, 1949   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 251 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, January 31, 2009 - 12:55 am:        I have been scanning too: the 9x12 Marine Diesel manual is scanned and available. John, I emailed you about it, but no reply.   David Bartle Visitor Posted on Wednesday, February 11, 2009 - 07:39 pm:        I have a scan of the 6 3/4 x 10 manual if anyone requires it.   David Bartle Visitor Posted on Wednesday, February 11, 2009 - 07:46 pm:        Also have the 9 x 12 scan too.   david_bartle New member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 1 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Sunday, March 01, 2009 - 10:24 pm:        Saltspring Queen Vivian 2 cylinder air start engines 5 x 8 attached to the 120 volt DC generators   andlar New member Username: andlar Post Number: 1 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 - 05:44 am:        Hi I have a steel tugboat located in Sweden built in Trenton, Ontario, Canada 1945 with a running 6 cylinder Vivian 9"x12" desel engine. I am intressted in history of the yard and also the Vivian company. I whould like to by an instruction manual in god conndition for this engine. And if there is someone that know any parts avalible for this engine in Europe or elswer, pleas let me know. Best regard. Anders Larsson   alcleary Member Username: alcleary Post Number: 15 Registered: 12-2003 Posted on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 - 09:14 pm:        Hi Anders: I live 15 minutes from Trenton Ontario and know that they did build boats in the 1940's for the war effort. If you could give me as much information as you can about the boat, like the length, serial number and a photo, I will try to research as much as I can. I have a few marine books but there is also a local "Collections and Archives for Marine History" that will help with the search. Hope this will help, Al Cleary   reggie Visitor Posted on Saturday, March 14, 2009 - 03:09 am:        hey anders...the new owner of the Ehkoli has many parts for the 9x12 vivian reg he's in B.C....I will check back   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 257 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, March 14, 2009 - 04:41 am:        Did you get my email Andlar?   andlar New member Username: andlar Post Number: 2 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Saturday, March 14, 2009 - 11:22 am:        Yes I got your emaile Mr Rober.   andlar New member Username: andlar Post Number: 3 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Saturday, March 14, 2009 - 11:26 am:        Hi reggi do you know the address to the Ehkoli? Best regard Andlar   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 258 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, March 14, 2009 - 11:31 am:        http://www.tc.gc.ca/shipregistry/menu.asp   gerard_vanzetta New member Username: gerard_vanzetta Post Number: 1 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Saturday, March 14, 2009 - 08:53 pm:        would like to see old manuals for "500"series 10 cyl.Vivian engines.12" X 12" bore&stroke.The only "true" square engines I ever scraped in new poured main berrings on.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 262 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, March 14, 2009 - 09:53 pm:        Hello Gerard, I don't have anything on those engines myself. Sorry.   reggie Visitor Posted on Sunday, March 15, 2009 - 02:03 am:        hey anders...he lives aboard and I don't know the adress of the marina ...bbut I will be seeing him next week and will bring his attention to this thread what parts are you looking for, I think he has more than a couple of everything :} ...reg   gerard_vanzetta New member Username: gerard_vanzetta Post Number: 2 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Saturday, March 21, 2009 - 09:19 pm:        still looking for info. on 10 cyl. 500Hp.12x12 Vivians.I think they were the last "500",s made. They were on the Alexander MaKenzie, a Canada Coast Guard ship,out of Prince Rupert B.C..Built in 1955,@ Yarrows,Victoria,B.C.   andlar Member Username: andlar Post Number: 4 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 02:58 am:        Hi Reggie,I am intressted in all kinde off parts. At the time I am checking rocker arms and might need some parts. I am also intressted in all sorts off tecnical info on the engine and the ship yard where the boat was built.   john a brinkman Visitor Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 09:36 pm:        hi gerry i have a square diesel 9x12 10 cyl. vivian 705 778 7246 tot siens   reggie Visitor Posted on Thursday, March 26, 2009 - 02:27 am:        Anders...Isaw him today, he said the ship wa built by mercers vancouver 1941 he has the same manual as above and the ship came with a very capable engineer, so ask your technical questions and I will pass them along. I asked him "what parts do you have" pistons liners con rods crank shaft injectors pumps rockers valves berings etc ...reg   andlar Member Username: andlar Post Number: 5 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Thursday, March 26, 2009 - 11:08 am:        Mr Brinkman can you tell some more about youre engine and is it just an engine or is it in a boat? Where is it located, do you have any spare parts?   john a brinkman Visitor Posted on Thursday, March 26, 2009 - 04:34 pm:        hi its just an engine was stationary gen. engine in eatons toronto its complet and now in my shop no spare parts have 8 cyl.vivian also thanks john ps trent river ontario   corey New member Username: corey Post Number: 1 Registered: 04-2009 Posted on Sunday, April 26, 2009 - 04:23 pm:        HI I have a Vivian 5HP that I am hoping someone can help with information. It is 2 cylinder, with one being a air commpressor. Serial number is 2387. I've read all of the information here on this site and haven't been able to find much information on the small ones. I believe it was probably used to make air for the starter. It appears to be original and complete. Any tips to steer me in the right direction for dating, parts, manuals, etc. would be greatly appreciated. Thank-you Corey PS-This is a great site!   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 267 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, April 26, 2009 - 09:27 pm:        Corey, there are no operating manuals available, nor have I ever seen or heard of one. From the serial number, I'd estimate this unit was made 1940-46. I have another starting compressor unit logged serial number 2398. The viewing ports on the crankcase cover of your engine I have not seen before. I assume someone added those; a good idea. Do you have any history on the engine?   corey New member Username: corey Post Number: 2 Registered: 04-2009 Posted on Monday, April 27, 2009 - 03:23 pm:        Hi Robert Thanks for your response. I purchased the engine in Cambell River BC quite a few years ago. I've been involved with other aspects of old engines. I haven't seen any other small Vivians. There must be some acompaning the larger Vivians discussed earlier. I am sure you noticed the barrel on the compressor had a pretty serious repair done to it. It still seems to function OK. If there was ever the possibility of finding a replacement I would certainly be very interested. Thanks for your help and any other information you have on the Vivians would be interesting. Corey   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 268 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Monday, April 27, 2009 - 09:39 pm:        Corey, I have a 'register' of Vivian gas and diesel engines I have heard of, or seen reference to with about 40 engines in it and as many again that are just nameplates. The gas engines were almost always saltwater cooled and as such tended to end up blown apart and discarded. No replacement heads or cylinders were available, or at least they became unavailable decades before Easthope parts did, and so fewer engines have survived until now. Of course Easthope parts are still available in some cases from Joe H. here on this forum. Is that frost or rust damage to the compressor cylinder? Quite a few of these compressor units seem to have survived; probably people thought they would be useful and so kept them when the engines they were used with were scrapped. As both cylinders were cooled as a unit, the corrosion problems are usually about the same from what I've seen. You could probably grind that brazing(?) down and improve the look if you wanted to. Is there any cracking in the front cylinder or heads?   redneckalbertan New member Username: redneckalbertan Post Number: 2 Registered: 06-2006 Posted on Monday, April 27, 2009 - 10:28 pm:        Robert, in your last post you mentioned that, "...gas engines were almost always saltwater cooled and as such tended to end up blown apart..." The question that I have for you is; what does being cooled with salt water have to do with the engines ending up wrecked? Is it that it is hard to retrofit a conventional closed circuit water cooling system or does it have to do with the salt in the water??   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 269 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 01:11 am:        Well, these engines like many other salt or raw water cooled engines, accumulate salt in the porous structure of the cast iron where it gradually corrodes and forms concretions that 'grow' and split the water jackets apart, and even crack the inner wall of the cylinder sometimes. This process is accelerated when the water jackets are allowed to dry out. I can't explain why, but that is well known from the experience of thousands of people and engines. Retrofitting a closed cooling system, (fresh water or coolant) will delay the process, but once the engine has been cooled with salt water for any length of time, the salts are deposited and removing them is a very difficult process that may never be done entirely. George's process detailed on this site of heating the salt-affected parts to 800 degrees or so for a prolonged period seems to eliminate or convert the salts that are embedded in the porous structure of the cast iron, but I'm not aware of any other method that can do this, except possibly the very protracted electrolytic baths used by museum conservators. These can take years of treatment with careful and continuous monitering to neutralized the salts. This salt issue is the bane of the existence of marine engine collectors and restorers, the evidence is everywhere to see on this site! There are more engines on the coasts, but in poorer condition than what you find on the lakes and rivers inland.   redneckalbertan New member Username: redneckalbertan Post Number: 3 Registered: 06-2006 Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 06:39 pm:        Robert, Thanks for your quick responce to the question. I didn't know that salt could have an effect like that on steel.   corey New member Username: corey Post Number: 3 Registered: 04-2009 Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 01:23 pm:        Hi Robert The 40 engines on your register, are they mostly large ones? What part of the world do most of them reside in? The damage on the compressor cylinder appears to be frost damage. Other than that, the entire unit does not show signs of much wear or any other cracks breaks or welds. I've considered wrapping a thin piece of something around the cylinder head, but so far it doesn't bother me that much. Appreciate your sharing of information. Corey   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 271 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Friday, May 01, 2009 - 11:53 pm:        Corey, they are mostly smaller gas engines and most residie in BC, with a few in neighboring states of the USA. As you can see from this thread though, Vivians, especially the diesels did get exported all over the world during and after WWII. There is an article in Raincoast Chronicles No9 on Will Vivian and his company which remains the best source published. There is also an article on Peck Easthope in Raincoast Chronicles No5, for those interested in Easthopes. Keep your engine full of straight anti-freeze and change it every 6 months or a year is the best advice short of a full rebuild with one of the above treatments. If you can pull a plug in the cylinder head and thread in hose fitting a put a piece of clear hose about a foot long on it. Then fill the jackets until the hose is mostly full. You can then see at a glance if fluid is being lost. This is what Mystic Seaport Museum does, so I read here once.   gsanford New member Username: gsanford Post Number: 1 Registered: 05-2009 Posted on Friday, May 29, 2009 - 02:44 pm:        robert,i have a vivian 7.5x10 four cylinder ,it is very good condition ,it was used to generate power as a backup for a small community. before that it was in a tug on a large lake in the central cariboo in bc.it looks to be used very little.it was maintained by a friends father untill his death a couple of years ago.and has not been started in many years .i will be starting it up soon and was needing some information. i hope you can help please contact me @780-865-6504 thank you.   kylec New member Username: kylec Post Number: 1 Registered: 09-2009 Posted on Saturday, September 12, 2009 - 06:10 pm:        Hello all, I am restoring a Vivian gas engine, 5 hp single cylinder, much like the one Corey posted the picture of above. Trying to figure out how much oil to put in it. There is no dipstick or site gauge at all that I can see. I have run the engine by setting the oil level just over the top of the con-rod bolts with the piston at BDC. The result was oil spraying all over the place out of some galleries on the engine and around the back of the crankshaft towards the transmission. We are suspecting that maybe the engine is only oiled from the external cups. Any help on this would be greatly appreciated. Below are two pictures of the engine in question. Serial Number is 1095 Please post here or reply via email to kgcameron 'at' hotmail.com Thanks in advance, Kyle Cameron   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 293 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, September 12, 2009 - 07:52 pm:        Thanks for posting. You've got one of the earlier engines there. I assume the tag is "Vivian Gas Engine Works", rather than "Vivian Engine Works"? You've got the earlier 2 bolt exhaust manifold. Later ones had four bolts. The engine dates to around 1927-29 as far as I can determine. I have engines 1006 and 1151. The closest numbers to yours I have recorded. Are there any markings stamped in the end of the gear lever on either side? The breather on the carb is not original as you probably know. Your restoration looks very nice. I'm assuming this was a fresh water cooled engine? The timing gears are lubricated by the oiler, but the main bearings are splash fed from the crankcase oil. You should be able to see the cast-in 'cups' in the top of the main bearing caps. The splash must fill these. If your rear main bearing is very worn, there will be oil lost into the pan below the gear. The gears also had a reputation for leaking and spraying oil, which is why they were enclosed later. Some owners would fabricate a sheet metal guard to catch the splash. You rearmost bearing has been converted a grease cup which was frequently done by owners. The pipe on top of the head is the water discharge if sea water cooling is being used. How are you cooling the engine now? Thanks for posting, great photos!   ehkoli_1941_9_x_12 New member Username: ehkoli_1941_9_x_12 Post Number: 1 Registered: 11-2009 Posted on Saturday, November 28, 2009 - 12:08 am:        hey all... thought I'd post a few pics of my spares, but first my new owner, Mitch... lots of crates and vivian diesel parts many parts are new,some used and factory rebuilds ...reg   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 301 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, November 28, 2009 - 01:55 am:        Welcome Ehkoli! Tell those of us who haven't heard of her a bit about the boat and her history, would you? Someone did well out of Crown Assets there obviously!   ehkoli_1941_9_x_12 New member Username: ehkoli_1941_9_x_12 Post Number: 2 Registered: 11-2009 Posted on Saturday, November 28, 2009 - 02:47 am:        thanks for the welcome robert wAs comissioned by the RCN in 1939 launched 1941 did hydrographic work for the navy and canadian hydrographic service in 1944 worked with the usnavy looking up inlets for possible german uboat hiding sites had a refit a nd docking in 1984 that was fit for a kings yacht and in 1993 was sold into private hands the site ehkoli.org has more those navy parts are really something and not only for the ehkoli but parts for the dundern sp are in the collection ...those pics of crates are just a sample really,guick guess says fifty of those red pumps next time he runs the engine plan is to video the operation , when he does I will get it posted   andlar Member Username: andlar Post Number: 6 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Saturday, November 28, 2009 - 03:21 pm:        Hi Robert and the new Ekholi, I am sorry to say that I have so litle time, but I am around. A pictures on the Canadian built T/B HERO from 1945 with a Vivian engien, located in the south west of Sweden in the town called Halmstad. Best regards, Anders Larsson.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 302 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, November 28, 2009 - 03:59 pm:        Thanks for those photos - what a treasure trove! I know where there is a NOS camshaft for a 6 cylinder Vivian if anyone ever needs one. Andlar, great photos! Do you know the size of engine in the this tug, or anything about her history or owners? Now a pleasure craft I assume? Thanks!   andlar Member Username: andlar Post Number: 7 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Saturday, November 28, 2009 - 04:50 pm:        It is the Great Vivian "9X12" six cylinder 240 hp engine, the ship is mostly original and is registarted in Sweden 1947 Under the name HERO, today it is T/B HERO. The ship is not used comercially but is still registrated as a tug in use. Best regards, Anders Larsson.   andlar Member Username: andlar Post Number: 8 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Saturday, November 28, 2009 - 04:55 pm:        The ship is built in Trenton, Ontario in Canada in 1945 for the US navy, and came to Sweden 1947. I do not know what kind of operations she hade befor that. Regards, Anders.   andlar Member Username: andlar Post Number: 9 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Saturday, November 28, 2009 - 06:48 pm:        For thouse who is intrested of some more older pictures on tugboat HERO can log in to a Swedisch websight: www.tugboatlars.se/Tugboatlars.htm and click: Bogserbåtar-Tugboats after that click: I bokstavsordning and scroll down to: Hero(2)(-av Falkenberg.av Hälle) There you will when scrolling see original pictuere from 1947 and others. Regards, Anders   ehkoli_1941_9_x_12 New member Username: ehkoli_1941_9_x_12 Post Number: 3 Registered: 11-2009 Posted on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 06:17 pm:        he all...just stopped in to leave a link to the new web page http://www.ehkoli.com/parts.html ..reg   geoffscott New member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 1 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Sunday, May 23, 2010 - 12:26 am:        Anyone have a copy of the instruction manual for the 5 1/2 X 8 Vivian. I did get the parts manual from Dave Bartle Email is [email protected]   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 372 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, May 23, 2010 - 04:53 pm:        Can't help with that one I'm afraid. Would like to get either myself.   geoffscott New member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 2 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Sunday, May 23, 2010 - 09:26 pm:        Robert: Dave Bartle may still have a copy of the parts manual. You could email him from here. If you have a problem get back to me and I will contact him and get permission to give out his email. Geoff   geoffscott New member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 3 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Sunday, May 23, 2010 - 09:29 pm:        Try Dave Bartle: He has a few manuals. Cheers Geoff   david_bartle New member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 2 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Sunday, May 23, 2010 - 11:13 pm:        I don't have a copy of the 5 1/8 x 8 operation manual but can make copies of the others if you wish. Probably too large to e-mail but can either post a printed copy or send a disc if you want. [email protected]   david_bartle New member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 3 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Sunday, May 23, 2010 - 11:17 pm:        I have been researching early Okanagan history (BC, Canada) and found out that quite a few towns, like Peachland and Westbank had their own power generation plants prior to the BCHydro distribution lines. They were powered by marine Vivians. Time to see if the museums have any manuals from these old power stations.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 373 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Monday, May 24, 2010 - 12:12 am:        Thanks Geoff! Email sent.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 4 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Monday, May 24, 2010 - 02:02 pm:        Dave: You probably know there is a Vivian Generator, in the BC Hydro Musium in Nanimo on Jinglepot Road. Interesting place to have a look any time. I think its a 9X12 number of cylinders I do not know. I was hoping to get a picture of it from a retired hydro worker. This never happened and he has now passed away.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 5 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Tuesday, June 01, 2010 - 01:58 am:          geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 6 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Tuesday, June 01, 2010 - 03:02 am:        This is a 5 cylinder 9X12 VIVIAN MFG. Date is around 1946 This engine has American Bosh Injection Pump for each cylinder. Earlier engines used a American Bosh Unit pump and long injection high pressure lines to the injectors. I collect pictures. If anyonehas any to share I would love to have them. My email is [email protected]   tedp New member Username: tedp Post Number: 2 Registered: 01-2011 Posted on Thursday, January 13, 2011 - 10:26 am:        I'm looking for any information on a Vivian 15HP serial 3143. Thanks Ted   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 402 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Friday, January 14, 2011 - 12:01 am:        There's not a lot to tell, but the engine was made circa 1945-50, and would be a two cylinder "Semi-Heavy Duty" probably. So far the Vivian sales/serial number ledgers have not surfaced, if they survived the wholesale dumping of the Vivian Engine Works assets and inventory in the mid-70s. One day maybe they will! Maybe with some photos we could tell you more. Do you have the engine or just the plate from it?   tedp New member Username: tedp Post Number: 3 Registered: 01-2011 Posted on Friday, January 14, 2011 - 09:20 am:        Robert Thanks for the info. I'm doing this for an old friend who is not computer literate. As I probe him for more information I have come to find he has a cylinder head in good condition that he would like to sell. We will get some pictures when he gets back into town. Thanks Again Ted   jeri New member Username: jeri Post Number: 2 Registered: 01-2011 Posted on Saturday, January 22, 2011 - 05:25 pm:        any one know what a 1949 model series 61/4" x 10" vivian diesel engine sells for?   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 403 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, January 22, 2011 - 06:17 pm:        Depends where you are Jeri, and if anyone wants it; other than the scrap man that is!   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 7 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Saturday, January 22, 2011 - 08:42 pm:        Robert: Really depends on condition and if it has spare parts etc. etc. Is that a 2 cylinder or ? There are two 5 12 X 8 twin cylinder diesels at a ship yard. They were overhauled and never run. Depends again maybe 1000.00 and that is just a quick guess.   rsterne New member Username: rsterne Post Number: 1 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Thursday, May 05, 2011 - 11:18 pm:        I have come across a 6 cylinder Vivian Diesel lighting plant. It was apparently in running order about 10 years ago. I will get some photos tomorrow but wanted to say HI to those who might have some knowledge about these engines. It was used in a mine and has (I am told) a 600 volt generator attached and a large radiator for cooling. It is supposed to be about 8' high and 14' long with the generator. If anyone has any interest and knows what it might be worth, please watch this thread for photos and more information.... Bob   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 423 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Friday, May 06, 2011 - 01:35 am:        I hope you can get to it before the metal thieves do! We're watching...   rsterne New member Username: rsterne Post Number: 2 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Friday, May 06, 2011 - 04:40 pm:        Well, here are the photos.... As you can see, it's a 6 3/4" Bore x 10" Stroke Six Cylinder Vivian Generator Set Serial Number 2495 with a Vivian Radiator.... Here are some particulars.... Westinghouse Generators: 94 KVa, 60 cycles, 600 Volts, 600 RPM, 90-5 Amperes?, Exc. Amps 23.5, 80% PF, Exc. Volts 125, 3 Phase, S.O. 26-C-472 Serial # 340806. DC Generator (above): 3.14 KW, 1800 rpm, 26 Amps, Shunt Wound, 125 Volt, Frame 254, S.O. 26C473, Serial # 3408000. American Bosch Fuel Injectors: Serial # 228760, Type unreadable. Manzel Forcefeed Lubricator: Model XU4006 - A24L Paramount Water Pump: "Refer To 3743 F?" The assembly is 14' long, 8' high, and 5' wide (plus muffler).... Does anyone have any idea of what it weighs and what it might be worth?.... It is located in south central BC Canada.... Bob   rsterne New member Username: rsterne Post Number: 3 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Friday, May 06, 2011 - 04:45 pm:        Here are more photos.... I couldn't post them all in one post.... Bob   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 4 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Friday, May 06, 2011 - 04:50 pm:        And a couple more.... Bob   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 5 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Friday, May 06, 2011 - 04:54 pm:        Last two.... Bob   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 6 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Saturday, May 07, 2011 - 05:07 pm:        robert.... When you come online, could you please email me at the addy in my profile.... I have some questions for you.... Bob   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 424 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, May 07, 2011 - 06:02 pm:        Bob I sent you an email. Thanks for the photos. Quite an engine and it looks very complete.   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 7 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Saturday, May 07, 2011 - 10:49 pm:        Still trying to come up with a weight on the engine or the complete lighting plant if anyone can help.... 6 3/4" x 10" Vivian 6 Cylinder.... Thanks.... Bob   david_bartle Member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 4 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Monday, May 09, 2011 - 12:06 am:        robert: send me an e-mail and I'll send you my Vivian files: [email protected]   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 8 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Saturday, May 14, 2011 - 05:43 pm:        I have a question about the location of the air intake.... It states in the manual that the air manifold is contained in the block behind cover plates, but the diagrams are not very clear.... It would appear that there are cover plates on the left side of the engine behind the exhaust manifold.... It that the location of the air manifold?.... and if so, where is the air intake?.... The only point I can see is a plate on the rear of the engine, left side, partially hidden by the exhaust pipe which is hanging down in the last photo above.... It appears to be galvanized or aluminum colour in that photo, and held on with 6 bolts.... Is that the location of the air intake?.... Bob   david_bartle Member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 5 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2011 - 07:05 pm:        Most of the intakes were screens on a plate between the exhaust manifold and the cylinder head. Some engines actually had a manifold but some only had screens (my guess is to keep the gulls out). As the engines were naturally aspirated there was no need to have an intake manifold connecting all the cylinders. (best guess)   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 8 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 01:52 am:        The Air Intake's are located on the exhaust side of the engine. Each cylinder has a cover plate with a screen. The screen is kind of hidden from view under the exhaust manifold.   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 9 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 10:59 am:        HI David and Geoff.... Thanks for the info.... makes sense that's why I can't see the intake in the photos.... I hope to hear late this week if this is going to happen.... Bob   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 10 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 03:21 pm:        I got another look at the engine today.... There are no screens on the plates behind the exhaust manifold.... and that plate on the left rear corner is actually a piece of plywood bolted on.... I'm guessing there was an air filter on this engine which was piped to (or bolted directly to) that location.... Since it was at a mine, it was probably in a dusty environment.... I did find out today that the engine was NOT run 10 years ago.... and in fact hasn't been barred over in more like 20 years.... Still no luck so far in finding a weight so pretty hard to figure out what is needed to move it.... My hopes for saving this engine from the scrap heap are beginning to fade.... Cross your fingers, everyone.... Bob   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 9 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 06:55 pm:        If it has solid plates it was probably piped to an air vent. If you remove the plates at the upper back, you will find a channel form one end of the engine to the other with a small plate on each end of the engine. These come off and duct work can be installed there. Have you got access to a flat bed truck with crane ? Do you plan to run this engine ? Large fork lift as well as the crane should load the engine with no problems. Maybe you could find some one that was involved in placing the engine where it is now ? They would be able to tell you what was used to move it. Always the option of taking some of the engine apart. Hate to see it go for scrap.   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 11 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 07:02 pm:        We have no plans to run the engine.... it's a piece of local history and we just want to keep it from being scrapped.... Nobody seems to remember how it was last moved, and the previous owner has passed away.... I'm still hopeful.... just frustrated.... Bob   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 425 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 07:59 pm:        Bob, I looked through the literature I have and could not find my 6.75x10 engine manual. However I did find a brochure that gives the weight of the "straight drive" eight cylinder version as 13,600lbs. A price list dated 1946 gives the price of that engine as $9735.00 "FOB, Factory, Vancouver BC". A goodly amount of money in 1946. Incidentally, the different engine sizes mentioned are 5.5x8, 6.75x10, 7.5x10 and 9x12. All built in 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, & 8 cylinders, except the 7.5 and 9 inch bored engines which were also available in 10 cylinder versions. So, you'll need to figure out roughly what the generator, excitor and generator/engine bed weigh to get your total.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 426 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 08:01 pm:        PS: Andrew, how do we avoid having our posts spread out so far left and right?   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 12 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 08:40 pm:        HI Rob.... I assume that weight is for an 8 cylinder 6.75 x 10"?.... If so, I would think the 6 cylinder engine would be about 80-85% of that.... let's say 11,000 lbs plus or minus.... I have no idea what the generator and exciter weigh.... but the engine bed I can probably take some dimensions on and get the weight per foot for the steel.... At least we now have some idea.... If you use the "Enter" key frequently, you can limit the width of your posts.... Bob   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 13 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 08:46 pm:        Inflation calculator shows that list price would be $118,375 in todays dollars.... Bob   david_bartle Member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 6 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 08:52 pm:        Alternator would most likely be the same weight as the engine. (10tons total?) This unit looks like it wouldn't take too much attention to make it run. Let me know if you think you might want a hand.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 10 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 10:15 pm:        Removing the alternator and exciter would be the first thing I would do. Five tons is not really that heavy. That way you can transport the engine and alternator ( two items ) if necessary. As per Daves post, let me know if you think you might want a hand.   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 14 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Monday, May 16, 2011 - 10:33 pm:        Dave and Geoff.... You guys are much too generous.... and you're going to get me into a LOT of trouble with my wife for suggesting we try and get it running.... but wouldn't it be wonderful.... *grin*.... You three (including Rob) will have a standing invitation to come visit if we can pull this off.... Bob   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 427 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Tuesday, May 17, 2011 - 01:21 pm:        Bob, my mistake. I thought you had an eight cylinder. The weight given for the six cylinder is 10,100 lbs. And thanks for the pending invite! ;-)   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 11 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Tuesday, May 17, 2011 - 01:39 pm:        10,100 lbs. You should be able to move that with out too much trouble. Are there any trucking companies in your area, with low bed trailers ?   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 15 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Tuesday, May 17, 2011 - 07:20 pm:        Still in negtiations with the owner and trying to arrange delivery.... Thanks, Rob, for the weight, that helps.... I was given a weight on a 100 KVa marine alternator of 1365 lbs. but I think that's WAY low.... haven't had a chance to get back and measure up the base yet.... The only crane near here has a blown engine and not enough businees to bother rebuilding it.... too bad, as it was a 12 ton.... Waiting to hear about a flatbed c/w crane but they haven't got back to me yet.... Everything here runs on hillbilly time.... *LOL*.... Bob   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 16 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Wednesday, May 18, 2011 - 03:34 pm:        I measured up all the steel in the base and radiator frame today and came up with a weight of about 1800 lbs.... That makes 6 tons plus the radiator (500 lbs?) for the basic unit without the generators in place.... Add in the water pump, and the piping and let's say 6.5 tons plus the generators.... which could of course be removed for loading.... Bob   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 12 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Wednesday, May 18, 2011 - 03:52 pm:        Sounds like the weight is under control. How far do you have to move it ?   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 17 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Wednesday, May 18, 2011 - 08:01 pm:        It has to be moved about 20km.... Still no call back from the guy with the flat deck.... *eyeroll*.... Bob   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 428 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Thursday, May 19, 2011 - 11:26 am:        Remember the ancients; use rollers! And keep your fingers out of the way! ;-)   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 18 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Thursday, May 19, 2011 - 01:51 pm:        Well we do have enough pine-beetle killed trees up here to make enough rollers for the whole 20km (without having to pick them up and move them).... mind you the hills on the road might be a slight problem.... *chuckle*.... Bob   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 13 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Thursday, May 19, 2011 - 06:07 pm:        Maybe you could jack it up and make a trailer out of it. Axle and a hitch and pull it with a Volkswagen. Might be fun on a parade day such as the 1st. of July. Might even be able to get it running for then. Cheers   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 19 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Thursday, May 19, 2011 - 06:24 pm:        Well I'm glad everyone is having fun with this, anyway.... The guy with the flat-bed got back to me and it's not insured and the HIAB will only lift about 5000-6000 lbs anyway.... Did I ever tell you how much I love living in a small town?.... *LOL*.... Any idea what a front-end loader can lift?.... Bob   redneckalbertan Member Username: redneckalbertan Post Number: 4 Registered: 06-2006 Posted on Thursday, May 19, 2011 - 07:43 pm:        Depends on the size of the front end loader, some less than 1000 lbs others would handle it without any problem. Are there a couple hardware stores/lumber yards in town? These usually have forklifts and for their size forklifts will usually lift more than a comperable sized loader. Just a thought. If the loader or forklifts that you can find don't have the ability to lift the whole weight of the engine you could always use 2 or 3.   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 20 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Thursday, May 19, 2011 - 07:59 pm:        One lumber yard.... The only big equipment is at the Weyerhauser Mill or the new Copper Mountain Mine.... So far we haven't been able to convince anyone it's a worthwhile project and good for PR.... but it's still early.... Bob   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 429 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Friday, May 20, 2011 - 11:08 am:        You might consider getting a couple of old truck front axles and making up adapter plates to bolt them to the engine bed itself. Hopefully you could do it on a Sunday or get the Mounties to look the other way!   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 21 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Friday, May 20, 2011 - 11:41 am:        I would think you would need pretty beefy axles and tires to carry 20,000 lbs.... and of course a way to jack up the engine and let it down again.... Manouvering it into it's final position is part of the problem as we don't have access from the "ends" only from one side.... A good idea, but not quite as easy as it sounds.... Things are still in limbo anyway.... The owner would prefer it go to a Museum or on public display.... I'm pretty much the last chance to save it if all else fails (which is likely).... Bob   farmer New member Username: farmer Post Number: 3 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Tuesday, May 24, 2011 - 09:38 pm:        This is my 3 Cylinder Vivian - nzvivian was talking about this engine when he posted earlier (2007!).   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 430 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2011 - 12:12 am:        Very interesting! Is that the original exhaust manifold or was there a water-cooled one originally? Is the builder's plate missing?   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 14 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2011 - 02:43 am:        5.5 X 8 engine I would guess 45 BHP ? If you referring to the open rectangle on the gear box side and flywheel side of the engine ? On the 5 1/2 X 8 that is the Air Intake. Depending on what installation and application, most marine engines had water cooled exhaust manifolds, others used on land, some did some did not.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 432 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2011 - 10:26 am:        5.5x8 Marine, 3cylinder 52bhp, Joe's Gear, (no reduction) price in 1946: $3,850.00 Haven't got the exact weight handy at the moment. Farmer, do you know the serial number? That's the plate I referred to. Geoff, I'm wondering if the smaller marine diesels didn't have water cooled exhaust manifolds, just as the smaller gas engines didn't. Although really, I don't think that makes sense myself. How are the water jackets holding up on this one Farmer?   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 15 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2011 - 02:47 pm:        I know for sure that the 5.5 X 8 Two cylinder had water cooled exhaust manifolds. I had two of them as generators, in a small ferry that used to run across the Fraser River where the George Massey Tunnel is now. Dave Bartel ran this same ferry at a different location on Salt Spring Island in later years.   farmer Member Username: farmer Post Number: 4 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2011 - 01:04 am:        No plate with serial, temporary manifold as rust in water jacket of original manifold has broken alarge section off, been welded.Plate on gear box lever, The Snow Nabstedt Gear Corp Hamden U S A .Only other numbers are on cover plates these may only be part numbers, is there any manuals that close to motor, thanks Don   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 16 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2011 - 02:48 am:        If your looking for a manual leave a message to Dave Bartle here. He may have something. The 5.5 X 8 manual, is a bit hard to find. I have the parts manual, but you probably don't need a copy of that. Dave would have a copy of that, I am sure.   farmer Member Username: farmer Post Number: 5 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2011 - 05:32 am:        Hi Dave Bartle , I have 3 cyl 5.5x 8 Vivian and woundered if you had a manual that suits this engine, thanks Don Heffer   david_bartle Member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 7 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2011 - 02:19 pm:        Hi "farmer" I don't think my manual will suit your engine. It is for a 6 3/4 x 10. I will keep my eyes pealed for you though.   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 22 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2011 - 12:10 pm:        I phoned the Vancouver Maritime Museum a while back to ask if they had any information on the Vivian Diesels.... I got a call back from the Librarian who had a brochure from Vivian on the 6 3/4" x 10" models.... She gave me a weight of 10,500 lbs which confirms what Robert said.... Still no word from the owner as their quest for a Museum or public place to display the generator bogs down.... I never heard back from the Britannia Mining Museum, but that didn't sound very hopeful anyway.... Fingers still crossed that I get it.... Bob   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 17 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2011 - 12:59 pm:        The weight sounds about right, I would guess. If and when you move it, did you find anyone with equipment to to that job yet ? I wonder if the Vancouver Maritime Museum has a Manual for the 5.5 X 8 that farmer was looking for ?   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 23 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2011 - 01:24 pm:        That weight is engine only, of course.... I haven't had any luck locating a method of moving it yet.... but am not putting in much effort until/unless I get it.... Bob   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 24 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2011 - 11:50 pm:        It looks like my chances of getting the Generator are now slim to none.... One of the local organizations is likely going to receive it for display purposes.... Hopefully it will be in a highly visible public area to avoid the metal thieves.... I'll let you guys know if anything changes.... in fact whatever the outcome.... Bob   wedivebc New member Username: wedivebc Post Number: 1 Registered: 06-2011 Posted on Friday, June 24, 2011 - 07:50 pm:        Interestingly I stumbled on this thread and found information about the Ehkoli which was a vessel I knew when it was with the Navy and the gen sets on the HMCS Cape Breton which I helped to rebuild one of them in 1978. It had poured babbit con rod bearings which we had to hand scrape to fit to the crank. You show a marine engineer a bearing scraper these days and they have no idea what it is.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 18 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Friday, June 24, 2011 - 10:04 pm:        Yes quite true. Even the main bearings that were babbited brass shell bearings needed to be fitted as well as the babbited bottom end bearings. The bottom ends had to be shimmed for clearance ( use of lead wire and micrometer ). If they were too loose the babbit broke up.   wedivebc New member Username: wedivebc Post Number: 2 Registered: 06-2011 Posted on Friday, June 24, 2011 - 10:19 pm:        Yeah we didn't touch the main luckily. There were 4 gen sets on the Cape Breton. One had been stripped for parts and an empty block was rusting away. The number one gen we managed to get running for a while before it ran away on us causing it to throw a rod. It damaged the crank and one head. We took the top end off 'ol #1 and put the whole block down on the crank bed of #2 after removing all the rusty top end from it. We got that running by some miracle and started on #3. It was seized but we used penetrating oil and a case of tabasco sauce to free up the rings and got it to turn over. When we put the air to it to make it spin the smell was like a big greasy taco.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 436 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Wednesday, June 29, 2011 - 05:41 pm:        Found a copy of a brochure on the 5 1/2 X 8 Series engines. Will scan for those interested in due course.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 19 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2011 - 03:24 am:        Robert: When you scan it, I would like to have a copy. Geoff   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 20 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2011 - 03:26 am:        Appreciate a copy if you scan it .   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 437 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2011 - 04:28 am:        Roger on that.   jman83 New member Username: jman83 Post Number: 1 Registered: 08-2011 Posted on Sunday, August 07, 2011 - 11:24 pm:        Does anyone have any diesel engine technical or service manuals that they could sell at a reasonable price or loan to be copied? I am trying to put together a library of diesel engine service/technical manuals for American, Canadian and British diesel engines from the earliest to the latest with the emphasis on pre-1975 or so engines.   david_bartle Member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 8 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2011 - 05:17 pm:        Found a guy who has the engine plate for the old Lloyd-Jones passenger ferry (Okanagan lake). photo attached.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 457 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2011 - 08:59 pm:        Nice plate, but not from the engines of course. The bigger diesels had a spec plate and a name plate I understand.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 21 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Monday, November 21, 2011 - 12:57 am:        The plate was located just inside the main door from the car deck to the engine room. It was on the M V Lloyd Jones and the M V Delta Princess which are sister ferries. The Delta Princess ran across the Fraser River at the foot of number 5 road in Richmond, before the Massey Tunnel was built across the river. The Lloyd Jones was on the Okanagan Lake before the bridge was built. She was cut up and brought to the coast and ran to Salt Spring Island. Excellent find ( whish I had found it )I was engineer on the Delta Princess when she was crossing the Fraser River. Cheers to you all. I have have a special place in my old heart for the old Vivians.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 22 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Monday, November 21, 2011 - 12:59 am:        The plate was located just inside the main door from the car deck to the engine room. It was on the M V Lloyd Jones and the M V Delta Princess which are sister ferries. The Delta Princess ran across the Fraser River at the foot of number 5 road in Richmond, before the Massey Tunnel was built across the river. The Lloyd Jones was on the Okanagan Lake before the bridge was built. She was cut up and brought to the coast and ran to Salt Spring Island. Excellent find ( wish I had found it )I was engineer on the Delta Princess when she was crossing the Fraser River. Cheers to you all. I have have a special place in my old heart for the old Vivians.   Nigel Visitor Posted on Saturday, January 07, 2012 - 03:45 pm:        Gentlemen. First I must say It was great to read this forum thread. I have a 6.75 X 10" 4 cylinder unit. Just reading the "Instruction book" , I do see some specifications , but tightening torques, head, rods ETC. would be great. I could just use standard torques from my books. Like this link http://www.rpmmech.com/docs/tightening_torque.pdf Any info may be sent to my e-mail address sale4item (at) shaw.ca I have found a stash of parts for this engine also ,but before any more damage is inflected upon this engine, I would like as much info as possible. I will be needing to measure the mains & rod bearings (Bumping the crank) I'm old , and thought that my 3/4 drive set was tools of the past. Thanks for the thread & read. Nigel   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 463 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, January 07, 2012 - 05:01 pm:        Is your engine out of Campbell River and the Billy B. Nigel?   Nigel Visitor Posted on Saturday, January 07, 2012 - 11:01 pm:        Not that I know Robert . Im still getting info / stories and such. inflected = inflicted * Can't edit , not a member,   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 23 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Saturday, January 07, 2012 - 11:31 pm:        Your could try Dave Bartle or Andy Hathaway for torque information. I have the instruction manual, but it does not have bolt torques in it.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 465 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2012 - 12:01 am:        It's easy to join here Nigel. What's the story on your engine then?   Nigel Visitor Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2012 - 05:45 pm:        Mr Robert . I will post the info as soon as I have All the true stories and the time line figured. Right now im just collecting that data.This engine is not mine nor do I have permission to post any info Yet! I stumbled on this forum Friday after work. Many of the old timers (older than dirt guys,Im sand) have pasted on or are in homes that care for them. I went and spoke to one gent in the home, Took as much info/pictures I had so it would jog his memory back & hopefully give him a smile. One question I would like to know is , How many Vivian's are in service today that is known & still run ? & how many are on display & still run . Reading Bob ( rsterne ) looks like he tried to save one. Many times I have seen older diesel's after there use, scraped out.Buried because movement was more than $/#. In the 70's I removed parts for older running engines in other plants that could use them, the bits not required were "Dumped" (that was the "Green" way back then).. Without great lengths of trouble , It would be nice to have that type of info also. I am also a BC subject to pay the overseers. now that you brought up Campbell River. Nigel   nigel New member Username: nigel Post Number: 1 Registered: 02-2012 Posted on Saturday, March 03, 2012 - 09:54 pm:        Joined , This is a test . Ahh all that hassle & Nigel is in lower case now. Plus I can't edit my original Nigel post .. ADMIN , can you fix please. User = Nigel .. Ill edit this so I can add the story of the Vivan, I'm on page two now. Thanks Nigel   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 478 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, March 04, 2012 - 07:27 pm:        Looking forward to it Nigel!   nigel New member Username: nigel Post Number: 2 Registered: 02-2012 Posted on Sunday, March 04, 2012 - 07:39 pm:        I login as Nigel But I can't edit squat : Editing Privilege Denied. I can change profile, after login , but can't edit the nigel or the Nigel post's. Im on page four, but if I can edit, then I can't post. I will be posting at our Euro site. darksideforums this being a open public one. Nigel   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 479 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, March 04, 2012 - 07:57 pm:        A tip from bitter experience Nigel: edit your posts in a word processing program first, then when you're happy with it, copy the text (highlight and copy) then paste into the forum. That way you have a backup copy if anything goes wrong during the posting or editing post process and it all gets "lost in cyberspace". Andrew, this page would be easier to use if we could insert a few hard-returns into some of VERRRY LOOONGG posts!   nigel New member Username: nigel Post Number: 3 Registered: 02-2012 Posted on Monday, March 05, 2012 - 09:21 pm:        I have it all done in a word processing program first as the norm with such a long post. Edit is for if I made a mistake , or if I need to remove or update some info. Nigel Edit worked after 5 mins. Signed. ;)   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 24 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Thursday, November 08, 2012 - 06:13 pm:        Not sure where I got the original information. I have tracked down the Vivian Generator Plant that one time supplied power to the town of 100 Mile House B.C. It is located in the Public Works Yard I understand. Weather permitting, I will go have a look and take some pictures. This may not happen till winter is over. I am pushing to have it located at the information center here in 100 Mile. There is a spot where they have old machinery on display. Let you all know how I make out.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 492 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, December 16, 2012 - 04:31 pm:        Geoff, how goes the effort on the Vivian? They ought to fix it up as well as display it, as they may be very glad of it again one day.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 25 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Monday, December 17, 2012 - 03:09 am:        Robert: Winter is here with cold temperatures and lots of snow. The power plant is in the Public Works Yard here in 100 Mile House. What I have seen so far it looks in fair condition and could possibly run as is with out too much work. Nothing much can be done till spring. I would like to see it moved to the heritage site here in the town. Cleaned and painted with the Vivian Green and then if possible restored to running condition. First is to get it on display. I will keep you informed.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 495 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Thursday, December 20, 2012 - 12:14 pm:        Thanks for the update Geoff!   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 25 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Monday, December 24, 2012 - 01:35 am:        A belated update on the local Vivian lighting plant.... It sounds like it's new home will be at the Princeton Museum.... No timetable as it will require building and/or cleaning out a shelter for it.... but it looks hopeful it won't be lost.... Merry Christmas to all and the best of New Years.... If you're ever in Coalmont, come look me up and I'll take you to see it.... Bob   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 497 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Monday, December 24, 2012 - 02:58 pm:        Good news Bob, thanks. And thanks for the offer and Merry Christmas to you too.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 26 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Thursday, January 24, 2013 - 02:40 pm:        I just got a up date on the power plant that once powered the Town of 100 Mile House. The engineer that operated the plant Dave Ohsanic is still alive and informs that there were three not just one. I will try a get a coffee with him if possible soon and find out more.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 27 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Thursday, January 24, 2013 - 11:01 pm:        Had a further conversation with the power house engineer this evening. There were two Vivian and One GM Diesel Generator Sets. The Vivian's were 40 KW and 60 KW units 2200 Volt 60 Cycle AC Generators with 120 DC belt driven exciters. One of these is in town. I will keep you informed as I find out more.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 507 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, January 27, 2013 - 07:00 pm:        Thanks Geoff; the engineer's comments on the engines would be interesting.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 28 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Monday, January 28, 2013 - 12:17 pm:        Sadly things came to a end this morning. The one remaining engine that was supposed to be at the Public Works Yard in 100 Mile House, was disposed of 2 years ago. I presume it went for scrap. The other two engines, no one seems to have any knowledge of where they might be. I will keep looking but the outlook looks grim at the moment.   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 29 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2013 - 11:57 pm:        I have found one of the vivian generators that were used to power 100 Town in the 1950's It is in good shape and is in Alberta. The owner Garreth Stanford advises me the other engine less the generator is still in a yard in 100 Mile House. The yard I think belongs to the Stanfords. I know the place and will go there next time I am in that area. Keep you all posted. Love to put this engine on display in 100 Mile Town. Picture is of the engine located in Alberta. Think is a 9X12 4 Cylinder Vivian Generator   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 508 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Friday, February 01, 2013 - 11:06 am:        Good going Geoff! Thanks for updating us. (Is the owner OK with his name being posted?)   geoffscott Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 30 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Friday, February 01, 2013 - 03:46 pm:        Yes no problem. I have a great picture but It won't upload here. Have tried various things but so far no luck. I can email a picture for you, ro any one that would like one.   miro Senior Member Username: miro Post Number: 666 Registered: 11-2001 Posted on Saturday, February 02, 2013 - 07:12 pm:        Robert, can you please email me about Joe's Gears. You can get my email from the profile, by clicking my name. Thanks, miro   geoffscott Advanced Member Username: geoffscott Post Number: 31 Registered: 05-2010 Posted on Wednesday, February 06, 2013 - 02:19 am:        Does anyone know the max RPM BHP and the year of the following engine. Vivian 71/2 X 10 Engine No. 3062 4 Cylinder Generator Set.   Kerry W Visitor Posted on Tuesday, June 24, 2014 - 11:20 am:        Wondering if anybody can shed any light on this one. Heard a rumour about a Belinda Diesel Stationary engine used to haul timber or generate power in Victorian High Country in Australia. Rumoured to be still sitting on it original location somewhere in the vicinity of Walhalla. Have few details heard it was a 2 cylinder diesel but like the name this may be incorrect. Wondering if it was actually a Vivian Diesel built under license in Australia, as cannot find any reference to the Belinda Diesel. The old timer who passed on the info may have been a few cents short of a buck and got the names mixed up. Has anyone heard of the existence of a Belinda Diesel? Found this 3 cyl 50 hp Vivian in a Museum in northern British Columbia.   nobby Advanced Member Username: nobby Post Number: 45 Registered: 12-2005 Posted on Tuesday, June 24, 2014 - 05:08 pm:        Nope never heard of Belinda, I am willing to bet that it is a Bolinder that the old timer was talking about. Cheers Nobby   Kerry W Visitor Posted on Tuesday, June 24, 2014 - 08:02 pm:        Thanks for that Nobby, that's the answer. Cheers Kerry   robint777 New member Username: robint777 Post Number: 1 Registered: 09-2014 Posted on Tuesday, September 02, 2014 - 02:49 pm:        Considering the purchase of a vessel with two 6 x 12 Vivian engines and lots of spare parts still in the boxes. Anybody have any interest before this vessel is cut up for scrap?   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 26 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Tuesday, September 02, 2014 - 03:27 pm:        Not sure what you mean by 6 x 12, is that the bore and stroke, and if so, how many cylinders are they?.... Any idea the last time they ran?.... There are lots of enthusiasts here, the more information you can give the more likely the engines can be saved from the scrap heap.... Bob   andlar Member Username: andlar Post Number: 10 Registered: 03-2009 Posted on Wednesday, September 03, 2014 - 04:10 pm:        Hi robint777, I am interested in information of the vessel with the two Vivian engines, and where it is located. And I am interested of engines and parts for my Canadian tugboat T/B HERO from 1945. Regards, Anders in Sweden   luisito New member Username: luisito Post Number: 1 Registered: 05-2015 Posted on Sunday, May 31, 2015 - 01:07 pm:        Robert, do you have any manual for an 8" x 12" Viv�an marine engine if so, can you please mail me the scan of it. Thank you, Luis Taub [email protected]   david_bartle Member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 9 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Sunday, May 31, 2015 - 07:50 pm:        rsterne (Bob) 6 x 12 is the bore and stroke. They came in multiple cylinders. More cylinders more horsepower. Some were air start and had to be put on the correct time mark on the flywheel so as to be able to turn over on air. The two cylinder for example could be set on the mark but had to be after the compression of #1 cylinder so there was a possability of the flywheel on the mark but on the wrong stroke. Vivian also made larger engines (9 x 12 for example). again these were made in many various cylinder combinations but all were in line. No Vee engines. Many of the 6 x 9's were used as power supply for towns around British Columbia prior to BCHydro running lines. Thus you will find a few in museums, and scrap yards in small towns. Occasionaly one or two are brought to light on this forum. Slow turning, not too powerful but lasted for a super long time. Great for tug boats, small ferries, and stationary power stations.   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 27 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Sunday, May 31, 2015 - 08:23 pm:        I had never heard of a 6 x 12 Vivian, the one I found in Princeton was a 6.75 x 10.... I was also aware of a 6 x 10 and the 9 x 12... I guess they came in many bore/stroke combinations.... Bob   david_bartle Member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 10 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Sunday, May 31, 2015 - 11:29 pm:        You are correct Bob! Not sure why you were asking about the bore and stroke though, You seem to know a lot about Vivians. correction. Now I see all the thread. You do know a lot about Vivians and I assumed you were actually inquiring as to how they were named. Me bad.   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 28 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Monday, June 01, 2015 - 12:38 am:        I guess the common sizes are 5.5 x 8, 6.75 x 10, and 9 x 12.... BTW, the engine/generator I found a few years ago is still kicking around, slated for the Princeton Museum, but they will have to find the funding to build a shelter/building for it.... We can only hope it survives that long.... Bob   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 727 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, August 07, 2016 - 01:08 am:        Nigel, anything new with your four cylinder Vivian diesel?   Patrick Lillis Visitor Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2017 - 07:25 pm:        Hi We have been given a Vivian 2 cylinder gas engine to rebuild. This engine was completely dismantled when received. All the parts are there and looks in very good shape. We would appreciate any help we could get such as manuals if available. The brass plate on engine is Engine 2096, Vancouver Gas Engine Works.   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 824 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Friday, January 20, 2017 - 01:10 am:        I guess that would be "Vivian Gas Engine Works"? What is the HP rating please? "SHD" or "HD"? One piece manifold or separate carbs for each cylinder? What is the bore? With a serial number around 3000 and "Gas Engine Works", I'd date it 1932-33. I have never seen or heard of a user manual for the Vivian gas engines. Unfortunately no literature seems to have survived, except a few catalogues and brochures. I'll email you a few illustrations that might help.   david_bartle Member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 11 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2017 - 12:48 am:        Here is an interesting article about Mr. Vivian and his company. The article can be found at:http://www.library.ubc.ca/archives/pdfs/bchf/bchn_1987_winter.pdf   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 826 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2017 - 11:17 pm:        That article is in my opinion largely a rewrite of the earlier article in Raincoast ChroniclesNo.9by David Conn: �Will Vivian, Pioneer Engine Builder.� Unfortunately the earlier article doesn't seem to be online anywhere. I see the Atchelitz Threshermen organization has been gifted the 8 cylinder diesel from the MV Leola Vivian, aka, "BC Surveyor" and a couple of others by the Vancouver Maritime Museum: "Vivian Engines ATA recently acquired several Vivian engines from the Vancouver Maritime Museum, including a large straight-8 marine engine. So here's a little background on the Vivian Company and its products. According to David Conn in an article in Raincoast Chronicles, WillVivian,1890-1965) was the Henry Ford of the Canadian diesel industry, though he has been largely forgotten today. After working in a San Francisco machine shop [Imperial Gas Engine Co.] as a teenager, Vivian returned to Vancouver in 1909 and set up his own company, the Vivian [Gas] Engine Works. [according to Peck Easthope, interviewed in Raincoast Chronicles No.5, Vivian also worked for Easthope Bros. after his return from California] At that time the BC fishing industry was converting to engine power, and Vivian was in the right place at the right time. His main focus was on four-cycle, long stroke, slow-turning marine engines. As time passed the company changed its focus to diesel engines because of their simplicity and efficiency and, Vivian was the first Canadian company to produce diesel engines. Will Vivian was very conservative, and once he had some success, did not like the idea of adaptation to changes in production methods and types of engines including high speed engines). He even turned downthe opportunity to build locomotive engines or even complete locomotives. After producing over 600 engines for the military during the Second World War, Vivian aggressively promoted their engines around the world, and achieved a modicum of success, but Vivian resisted the move to light and compact diesel engines which were easier to install and service and were produced using mass production methods and more modern metals technology. This meant that Vivian lost out to their opposition in the postwar period. In 1949 Vivian sold his interest in the company to Brush-Able of England. The Vivian name disappeared in the early 50's when Brush-Able was bought out by Hawker-Siddeley. The company continued to produce parts for surviving Vivians at least into the 1980s. [Not according to my source] Conn noted that the [Vancouver] Maritime [Museum] had 4 Vivian engines, and these are the engines that the ATA acquired this year." http://www.atchelitz.ca/wp-content/uploads/Flywheel-3109-September-2013-v43.pdf I'm interested to know what they have done with the unique 60-80ph three cylinder gasoline engine which was used in a Stone Brothers Towing tug out of Port Alberni, and which I saw in the Museum's storage in the early 1990s. A massive engine with a massive Schebler Model R(?) carburetor. I'd also be interested to know what the Museum did with the considerable number of smaller gas engines they then had in storage, including a 15hp twin Vivian with badly cracked manifolds and cylinders.   hank_pronk Member Username: hank_pronk Post Number: 4 Registered: 04-2013 Posted on Sunday, January 22, 2017 - 10:15 am:        Hello, I have a 15 hp Vivian heavy duty powering my 36 foot side wheeler. The engine has some hair line cracks in the jugs that leak a tiny bit of water until it heats up. Is there a solution to this or is it best to leave it alone. thanks' Hank   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 830 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Sunday, January 22, 2017 - 04:17 pm:        Hello Hank, That would depend on whether they were frost cracks or rust cracks, but if your engine was salt water cooled for any length of time, you have may rust scale growing in the jackets and pushing out the walls far enough to crack them. There are treatments, but not easy ones. If you're sure they're caused by rust scale, you can take a look at what George Coates has done in other threads on this site. If you strip the cylinders, heads & manifold(s) down, you can bake them in a self-cleaning oven to burn out oil and dirt residues. At that point you could cut open the jackets with a zip disk on an angle grinder and clean them out manually and braze or weld back together, or pump a rust dissolving solution through the water jackets. Acetic acid is one, but there are commercial ones too. Slow process and of course there's no way to check the results except maybe putting a borescope down the coolant holes in the top rim of each cylinder and in the bases of the heads. A gentleman in Alaska has recently cast some very fine reproduction cylinders for 15hp Vivians, but I will let him tell that story himself when he is ready. ;-)   hank_pronk Member Username: hank_pronk Post Number: 5 Registered: 04-2013 Posted on Sunday, January 22, 2017 - 07:39 pm:        Hi Robert, Thanks' for the input. In the absence of a simple solution, I think I will just keep running her until it becomes a problem. In the mean time I can look into having new cylinder made.   david_bartle Member Username: david_bartle Post Number: 12 Registered: 02-2009 Posted on Tuesday, January 31, 2017 - 07:13 pm:        A copy of Vancouver Archives photo from the Rainforest Chronicles #9.   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 29 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Friday, February 17, 2017 - 11:20 pm:        OH, David.... you just had to post that and make me drool all over my keyboard, didn't you.... *LOL*.... Bob   kootenay_lake_ferries New member Username: kootenay_lake_ferries Post Number: 1 Registered: 02-2017 Posted on Saturday, February 18, 2017 - 10:27 pm:        Hello, In reading about Will Vivian and his Company, I'm left with one question. It seems the original corporate entity was called Vivian Engine Works Ltd. Earlier a member noted that Vivian Diesels & Munitions Ltd. was incorporated in August, 1942. What was the relationship between the corporate entities or were new investors brought in and a new corporation formed. Thanks, Michael   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 839 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Tuesday, February 21, 2017 - 09:53 am:        The original name was "Vivian Gas Engine Works", then "Vivian Engine Works" when they began to make diesels in the early 1930s. The original factory was on West 6th Avenue; I believe the address is in David Conn's article. The "Vivian Diesels & Munitions" plant was on Station Ave. They were separate entities, but what the ownership and investor status was I don't know. However Bill Vivian definitely controlled both companies. Both plants are long gone now, as is all the company documentation as far as we know.   Bob Jenneson Visitor Posted on Tuesday, June 06, 2017 - 05:00 am:        Hi All.....It's interesting to see pictures and hear experiences about the good old Vivian engines. I was in the Canadian Coast Guard in the early 70's serving out of Prince Rupert on the MV Alexander Mackenzie . She was a lighthouse tender 128' at the waterline and powered by two 9x12 10 cyl. supercharged Vivian engines. I served as 4th then 3rd engineer under chief engineer Gerry Mulder and 2nd engineer Conrad Simonson. The engines fed through reversing gearboxes. They were great engines. Several times the Chief would have me overhaul a cylinder while we were anchored up over night. We were on four hour watches and it was possible to complete a cylinder overhaul in less than four hours. That includes scraping the bearings. The blowers were on clutches and could be engaged when required. The blowers would bring down the exhaust temp. to a point where you could increase the RPM until Max. Temp was once again reached. The blowers were only used when we were on a rescue mission. As I recall they gave us an extra 2 knots (for a total of 10 knots). Kind of a slow rescue. The Alex Mac was originally built for service in the St Lawrence River and so was flat bottomed and round chined. Imagine the fun out on Hecate Straight in a blow! Just thought i would chime in Bob   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 883 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Thursday, June 08, 2017 - 01:43 pm:        Great stuff Bob; the experiences and opinions of those who ran the engines are as interesting as the engines themselves, at least to me. Anything else you'd like to share would be much appreciated. Dixon Entrance is a scary place in a storm too I've heard.   caper1212 New member Username: caper1212 Post Number: 1 Registered: 03-2018 Posted on Monday, March 12, 2018 - 02:55 pm:        Good Day, I recently acquired a Vivian Diesel & Munitions Genset, 6 3/4 bore x 10, and i think the serial is 2626. Still has the old leather type fan belts on it. I'm trying to figure out the weight of the unit, and some info about this engine. Thank You!   robert Senior Member Username: robert Post Number: 953 Registered: 07-2003 Posted on Friday, April 06, 2018 - 03:46 am:        Where are you located caper1212, roughly speaking? Will try and find out a weight for you.   sanford New member Username: sanford Post Number: 1 Registered: 08-2018 Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2018 - 02:07 pm:        Good day all, I have an early 30�s Vivian for sale if anyone is interested it included a 75Kv generator , if there is any one interested . Thanks   rsterne Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 30 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Friday, October 19, 2018 - 01:15 am:        Sanford, please give some details on your engine.... bore, stroke, number of cylinders.... Do you have a pic....   rsterne Advanced Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 31 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Thursday, August 26, 2021 - 09:19 pm:        HI Guys.... Still alive and kicking in Coalmont.... AFAIK, the Vivian is still where I saw it, and the Museum have never managed to move it or build a shelter for it.... Can anybody tell me what the HP @ RPM is for a 6.75 x 10, 6 cylinder?.... Bob   rsterne Advanced Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 32 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Saturday, November 12, 2022 - 11:05 pm:        I'm glad to see this Forum is still alive!.... I haven't been able to access it for a few months, glad it's back!.... Bob   rsterne Advanced Member Username: rsterne Post Number: 33 Registered: 05-2011 Posted on Saturday, November 12, 2022 - 11:42 pm:        The Vivian 6 cyl. Gen-Set I reported on in May of 2011 is still around, and seems to have survived the Princeton Floods in Nov. 2021. I haven't seen it personally, but this photo was posted on Facebook in Oct. 2022.... Bob   bsterne New member Username: bsterne Post Number: 1 Registered: 12-2022 Posted on Monday, December 12, 2022 - 11:17 am:        My emal has changed, so I had to change my username from rsterne to bsterne.... Bob   bsterne New member Username: bsterne Post Number: 2 Registered: 12-2022 Posted on Friday, January 12, 2024 - 04:24 pm:        I would like to contact robert, geoffscott, david_bartle, or anyone else that has experience with Vivian diesel engines regarding the 6-cylinder gen-set in my post above from May of 2011.... It is now in the possession of the Princeton Museum, and they are looking for help.... You can reach me at air gun bob at gmail dot com (no spaces, you get the idea), email me and I will give you my phone number if you wish.... Bob